London stabbing 2
Extremism

London stabbing: Met and BBC say mental health a "significant factor", but what's the whole truth?

 

Appalling stabbing incident in Russell Square, London. A woman in her 60s has been murdered; five others are being treated for knife wounds. According to the BBC: “A 19-year-old man was arrested at 22:39 after a Taser was discharged by an officer. The Met said mental health was a ‘significant factor’ in the events.” That’s a remarkably swift diagnosis of psychiatric health. Perhaps we can assume that all people who go on rampages with knives have “significant” mental health issues. Perhaps mental health is now defined this way.

We used to be given names, descriptions or CCTV footage of assailants or suspects. Not in this case. At least not at the time of writing. We read: “The suspected attacker was arrested shortly after 10.39pm and is currently in police custody at hospital.” So they obviously know what he looks like and what he was wearing. They might even have a name. Such facts are much easier to easier to ascertain than a diagnosis of psychiatric health. They are visible and immediately knowable. We are told the “guy kept screaming his guts out”, but we are not told what he was screaming. Perhaps it helped to diagnose the state of his mental health. We don’t know.

Perhaps the BBC is just faithfully reporting what the Met have given them. Perhaps the article will be updated as more facts become known. Perhaps they were already known, and the BBC decided they weren’t relevant. We don’t know.

But it’s curious, isn’t it, how mental health is judged so swiftly to be a “significant” factor. Perhaps the assailant was carrying Prozac. Perhaps, as he was being tasered, he demanded serotonin-noradrenaline reuptake inhibitors as a human right. Perhaps he spoke of how he felt misunderstood, outcast, rejected by society. Perhaps he was unemployed and depressed. We just don’t know.

Perhaps it’s unhelpful to speculate about the ethnicity and religion of the assailant. Perhaps ‘assailant’ is also an unhelpful term if he has significant mental health issues. It was a ‘he’, wasn’t it? Yes, we know the sex of the suspect. And ‘suspect’ is a much better term, even though the police tasered him and currently have him under armed guard. Innocent until proven guilty, and all that. Act of terrorism? No, we can’t go with that: it’s just a ‘classic’ random stabbing – for the moment, anyway. So, we have a male suspect involved in a London stabbing who has “significant” mental health issues which are obviously mitigating. Yes, that’s the story.

Other facts are obviously known. But these truths must be withheld. The Mayor of London Sadiq Khan has called for the public to remain “calm and vigilant”. Yes, that’s the message. A 19-year-old man (how do they know his precise age before his name?) with significant mental health problems has murdered a 60-year-old woman and slashed five others, and we must keep calm and carry on. Nothing to see here.

Funny thing, truth. It requires clarity of thought and expression. It derives deep metaphysical speculation and complex judgments, such as those pertaining to religious mania or psychological health, from the most obvious facts and indubitable distinctions. The starting point must always be what is known, with a rational apprehension of how what is known has been made known. Sensibilities change, but the form of facts does not.

The human mind and heart can be moved in various ways, depending on how those facts are presented (or not). The Met and BBC can suggest shadowy lines of thought, and the Mayor of London can issue a command to be calm and vigilant.  But neither can command the mind to move to assent to something, especially if something more is suspected. Is it too much to ask that the establishment bear witness to truth? Or do they presume we have no interest in finding it? Isn’t it rather patronising to withhold it and exhort calmness and vigilance, when that very exhortation releases passions and induces concerns? Vigilant about what? Teenagers with mental health problems? Isn’t that a rather malleable conviction or manipulated truth, not to mention a slander on all who suffer mental health problems? Isn’t the whole truth a far better breastplate against extremism and shield against stereotyping than filtered facts and mediated knowledge?

  • DP111

    These acts are by people with mental health problems.

    We should call these acts “Mental health Terrorism”. We should increase mental health expenditure.

    This is all the fault of Margaret Thatcher, or it could be Brexit, or even Trump Derangement syndrome.

  • The Explorer

    With the Munich shooting, a white man was said to be involved. Since he was white (or thought to be at the time) it was permissible to mention his ethnicity. When the Munich attacker’s middle name was found to be ‘Ali’, that was deleted from reports about him.

    We have been told that the Russell Square knifeman is 19. We have not been given his name or told that he is white. From that, certain inferences may be drawn; so clearly that we might as well have been given the information.

  • chefofsinners

    Yes indeed.
    Given recent events in France it would greatly reassure the public if there was a clear statement that there is no suspected link to terrorism. The absence of such a statement raises suspicions.

    My first reaction to Sadiq Khan’s words were to marvel at how quickly an ordinary man becomes a mouthpiece of the establishment. “Keep calm and carry on.” Where have we heard that before? With all its implications that we simpletons must trust the great men unquestioningly. Ours is not to reason why…

  • The Explorer

    There are those who think that religious believers are, by definition, mentally unstable. Thus, not all those who are mentally ill are religious, but all those who are religious are mentally ill.

    So to say there are mental health issues involved could be code for saying religion is involved.

    • Merchantman

      I seem to remember in the later days of the Soviet Gulag most opposing the USSR were declared mentally deranged and sent to the psychiatric hospital. No trial, no publicity, Non-person. How convenient

  • TIME to CTRL ALT & DEL

    Are the authorities now telling us that Islamic belief is a mental heath problem?
    If so how do they propose dealing with it – is it best at source?
    I shall be interested to see how this hole is squared.

  • Uncle Brian

    Britain, France and Germany are said to be the Islamic State’s prime targets for its “lone wolf” operations.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/04/world/middleeast/isis-german-recruit-interview.html

  • B flat

    Your Grace,
    Who in the Establishment, has cared for Truth since Pilate asked Jesus what it is?
    Everything is subservient to a personal or party view of what is paramount at the given moment, in our dead and now decaying atheist culture.
    It is good to point out particular anomalies, as you have done so elegantly and damningly. But I doubt it will change anybody’s eyes or mind to what is going on.
    The political leaders and media are so corrupted by the zeitgeist that there is no saving them from the inevitable consequence of their betrayal. They are beyond reason, beyond the clear meaning of ordinary language, and certainly a million miles from seeking wisdom so that they can know Truth.
    Unfortunately, their betrayal of this land and its people, will destroy most of us living in Britain as well.

  • len

    The police are now able to offer ‘psychiatric judgements’ on every attacker almost instantly….or so it seems..

    • Royinsouthwest

      Not in all cases, just those where it is politically expedient to do so.

  • Stig

    I don’t know about mental illness, but such actions are certainly symptoms of spiritual sickness. What was once was once called “possession by demons”, but that term isn’t fashionable any more. If those terms were used instead of “mental health” I don’t think we’d argue that they were wrong. So I’m sure that spritual health is really what they mean, but it is not politically correct to say that.

    • len

      ‘The demonic’ is no longer being restrained and is becoming more active almost daily….this is happening in all aspects of society….But in a secular world ‘demons’ don’t exist ..

  • CliveM

    A certain distant relative of mine, during a manic episode, was arrested walking the wrong way on the hard shoulder of a motorway, on their way to murder someone called Dave (we are still to find out who Dave is). They were arrested by the Police. They weren’t taken to the Police station, but directly to hospital.

    Sometimes it is immediately obvious that mental health issues are present.

    • bluedog

      Quite right, Clive. There’s no place for a somewhat cynical exercise in racio-religious profiling either. On the other hand, if it turns out that the words the youth was screaming are a well-know religious cry, we will immediately know that not only was the suspect acting consciously but also he was no lone-wolf. It’s that easy.

      • CliveM

        From “on the other hand……” Onwards, I don’t see how one necessarily follows on from the other. How would it prove it wasn’t a lone wolf attack?

        • bluedog

          Precedent and probability, Clive. Although there is always the possibility of the exception that proves the rule.

  • David

    An appalling multiple crime has been committed, involving murder and stabbing five other people. So it is indeed very concerning when the establishment and its mouthpiece the BBC rushes to give, as explanation, medical conditions that are often complex, but whilst withholding far more basic information about the person’s name, nationality, ethnicity and religion. Far from being reassuring this merely suggests to anybody, even half alert to the ancient war that is now again being waged against the west, that this act was a response to the call of Isis.

    • Dreadnaught

      If there were any checks on illegal or otherwise immigrants, a clear bill of health, criminality and self sufficiency would be essential as it was in the days of Ellis Island.

  • David

    I’ve just noticed that The Daily Express has updated this story, now reporting that the detained man is of Somalian origin. It further states that two additional men of “middle eastern ” appearance were nearby, but left on a motorbike, implying that these two may be linked to the events. So at least one popular newspaper claims to know the “suspects” nationality, and therefore probably, his ethnicity and religion. Facts, if this is what they are, tend to become known…

  • The Meissen Bison

    Interpreting official stories is becoming the kind of art form familiar to the erstwhile readers of Neues Deutschland or Rude Pravo or any of the state organs of the Comecon era.We have the age of the perpetrator, we have no mention of his ethnicity, we do not have his name. This all adds up to only one thing.Throw in ‘mental illness’ – another coded term – and exhortations to being vigilant as opposed to being vigilante and the runes could scarcely be easier to read.

    • Politically__Incorrect

      Both the BBC and the Daily Telegraph reported that he is a Somali

      • Not originally: the BBC article has been updated twice since this blog post was written (and will doubtless go on being updated). The point is that the suspect’s mental illness and age were disclosed before his name and any indication of ethnicity.

  • The Explorer

    One eyewitness account says the knifeman was screaming; another that he was silent. With the report that he was screaming, there is no reference to one particular phrase. Two possible explanations for that.

    1. He didn’t say it.

    2. He did say it, but to report the fact would be to alarm the public, or lead them to erroneous conclusions.

  • David

    Breitbart London is now also referring to the murderer as of Somalian origins. Last time I checked most Somalis are Muslims.

  • Politically__Incorrect

    A good and timely article YG. It does not take a huge leap of the imagination to envisage a trend where “minor” terrorist attacks such as stabbings are dismissed by the authorities and media as down to “mental illness”. Such a deception would have the dual effect of “reassuring” the public that we are not under attack by jihadists, and would sweep the crime under the convenient and less controversial carpet of mental health.

    The man was a Somali from Norway. He was therefore probably Muslim and an asylum seeker / refugee. Being from Norway, it is unlikely that had any medical records on him, and the diagnosis of mental illness probably came from superficial observations of his behaviour. It’s worth remembering that drugs can also result in psychotic behaviour. If the man was having an acute mental breakdown it is likely he would have sedated. Therefore, why the armed guards? If I have learned one thing recently, it is to never take the media, especially the BBC, at face value.

  • Martin

    It is to the benefit of rulers that a population is distracted by fear, that the ruler is seen as the one who can control the cause of that fear. Terrorism attacks the ruler by showing he is not in control. Threatened terrorism can be counteracted by that which is not terrorism, but might be perceived to be in the absence of information, being shown to be under control.

  • Politically__Incorrect

    Interesting that the attacker has been release so quickly from hospital and is now being questioned at a Police station. Is that how they deal with somebody having an acute mental breakdown?

    • Mike Stallard

      Everyone in England knew Rolf Harris’ name when he was arrested.

      • Anton

        What was Rolf Harris’ name when he was arrested?

  • Albert

    The moment they said that he had significant mental health problems, I guessed, as we all did I think, that this was terrorism. Not, of course, because I think that people with mental health problems are terrorists – far from it. But because it is acceptable to blame people with mental health issues than to blame Islamists. There seem to be few motives for such random attacks:

    1. robbery
    2. terrorism
    3. mental health

    1. seems to have been excluded on evidential grounds. That leaves 2 & 3. 2. will not be admitted unless evidence is produced for it. Therefore, even in the complete absence of evidence, this must be blamed on the mentally ill.

    Who speaks up for the mentally ill in all this, and asks these crimes not to be pinned on them until there is publishable evidence?

    Curiously, it has slipped off the top billing on the BBC, in favour of the much safer interest rate cut (which of course fits the BBC’s narrative of the damage of Brexit).

    • A report by Turning Point in 2013, states that:

      “In 2012 there were 61,258 mental health related calls; this is 21,741 more than robbery and 47,203 more than for sexual offences. The Metropolitan Police Service review also stated that it has been estimated that 15% to 25% of incidents are linked to mental health. Using this estimate the daily contact rises to a minimum of 1,626 calls per day — the equivalent of around 600,000 calls per year.”

      The police would appear to have considerable expertise in dealing with mental health related crime.

      • Albert

        This may well be true, but what is evident from this thread is that there are a lot of people who are gaining in scepticism when it comes to believing the authorities in such matters. Things have not been helped by the bizarre way in which details have been disclosed. As Cranmer says below: the point is that the suspect’s mental illness and age were disclosed before his name and any indication of ethnicity.

  • Dreadnaught

    Islamism is a mental disorder.

    • PessimisticPurple

      I believe Churchill actually used the word “hydrophobia”, not “rabies”.

      • Dreadnaught

        Who the hell mentioned what word Churchill used? Hydrophobia unlike like the made up word Islamophobia, is a symptom of the disease Rabies; for Rabies read Islam.

        • PessimisticPurple

          In volume one of “The River War”, Churchill wrote, “Islam in a man is like hydrophobia in a dog”. This is often misquoted as “rabies in a dog”. I’m assuming you weren’t trying to pass off Churchill’s bon mot as your own coinage.

          • Dreadnaught

            I didn’t use Churchill’s ‘bon mot’ but the expression of mad as a rabid dog I think existed long before Churchill.

  • Merchantman

    My guess is that even to discuss such things, will in due course become treasonable.

    In fact just like old times Your Grace.

  • Is it too much to ask that the establishment bear witness to truth?

    If I may wheel out the former MP George Walden, writing in his book in Time to Emigrate?:

    I’d be so alarmed by the situation that I’d do everything possible to suggest it was under control. It’s up to politicians to play mood music in a crisis, and up to the people to understand that there’s little else governments can do. The last thing they can say is that we face a threat to which we can see no end because it’s based on a fundamental clash of cultures. On the IRA we told the truth; on the Islamic problem, we lie.

    Islam was brought to the West to undermine Christianity, with a view to its eventual eradication, an exercise wholly incompatible with the truth. Lies are, of course, the stock-in-trade of politicians but it is dispiriting to see the police selling their souls.

    In the latest issue of the IS magazine Dabiq (download here), the article ‘Why we hate you & why we fight you’ (page 30) has beautiful expositions of Islamic belief and extremely valuable insights into the Muslim psyche.

    • Dreadnaught

      Islam was brought to the West to undermine Christianity
      Any citable evidence to back this up? I think Western religion has been sputtering out since we went to war twice … with god on all sides.

      • @ Dreadnaught—The sheer intensity of hatred towards Christianity, and atheism, in the Dabiq article rules out the notion that Islam was imported to benefit the West.

        • Dreadnaught

          Who ( person, Party, Organisation etc in UK) actually brought Islam in for the purpose you maintain? Straight question.

          • @ Dreadnaught—Sir Alan Duncan talks of ‘a very important financial lobby’ which dominates the politics of the United States. Thinking about British immigration policy, I am always struck by Churchill’s 1955 confession to Ian Gilmour: ‘[immigration] is the most important subject facing this country, but I cannot get any of my ministers to take any notice.’ The Churchill who proposed ‘Keep England White’ as an election slogan was powerless to act: the decision to subject Britain to Third World immigration had been taken.

          • Dreadnaught

            So what you are saying is that there never was a decision taken by anyone or any organisation to supplant Christianity with Islam, apart from Islam itself: which is something I can agree with. This poses the more apposite question of Why rather than object, the Churches fell over themselves to welcome and even house their historically sworn enemy.

          • Mike Stallard

            Actually, just as teachers were always right about smoking, so the Catholics have always been right about the family.
            Let me remind you: a sacred sacrament between a man and a woman who promise to bring up the children in the love of God and neighbour.
            What has happened is the very opposite: bucketloads of sex in all shapes and sizes, and very few children at all. Family? It is just a lifestyle choice. Sacrament of marriage? Owned by the government to gift to any voter who makes enough protest.
            Result: population vacuum into which immigrants flood.
            If people had listened to the Catholics, then the population would have remained steady and immigration would have been containable as it had always been.
            But children have always smoked (I started aged 11 with a magnifying glass behind a bush) and nobody listens to the Catholics because they are all kiddy fiddlers (see above).

          • @ Dreadnaught—
            ● The campaign to open Britain and the US to mass immigration began over a hundred years ago, long before Islam had a shred of influence in the West.
            ● It wasn’t the Muslim community that took exception to Alan Duncan’s remarks.
            ● God knows what church leaders are up to. Perhaps they believe their own propaganda about the blessings of diversity. Perhaps they are stupid. Perhaps they are evil.

          • Ivan M

            Church leaders in the UK are irrelevant, excepting NI during its troubles, and have been so for at least half-a-century.

          • Merchantman

            Gilmour certainly did nothing to discourage the tide.

        • Dreadnaught

          So what you are saying is that there never was a decision taken by anyone or any organisation to supplant Christianity with Islam, apart from Islam itself: which is something I can agree with. This poses the more apposite question of Why rather than object the Churches fell over themselves to welcome and even house their historically sworn persecutor.

          • Albert

            My guess is that it was part and parcel of secularism. The idea had become widespread, even among religious people, that religion was not really political (in the sense of being confrontational – most political parties were very Christian until recently). On the basis of equality, the assumption was that other religions would be similarly non-political. And that has been largely true. Even with Islam, most Muslims in the 70s say, simply settled down with their work and voting Labour (as most immigrants did).

            So as the West has secularised, it has blinded itself to the real situation.

          • Dreadnaught

            ‘Secularists’ even if they could be a homogenous group, defend the right for freedom of religion for the individual.
            The fact that people questioned the concept of religious faith and its special place in politics and privileges under the conventions of the unwritten constitution can not be denied. The fact that the Church of Rome pandered to the protection of kiddie fiddlers while the CoE went to sleep at the wheel even with its special seat in the House of Lords. It can’t be laid at the feet of secularism as a philosophy of defending its right to exist.
            The CoE is at the heart of the Establishment – how closer to the seat of power could it have been to preserve its own existence?

          • Albert

            What an extraordinary response. None of which addresses any of the issues raised in my post. Your need to pretend that child abuse is a peculiarly religious issue is telling.

          • Dreadnaught

            No need to pretend that the abuse is not a serious breach of trust by those who preach love and compassion. The abuse was bad; the cover-ups and denials even worse.

          • Albert

            All of which is true, but 1. Irrelevant to the present question and 2. irrelevant to the problems of secularisation because child abuse is not a specifically religious issue. The moment anyone objects to your trashing of Western culture – or even, as in my post, simply points out an effect of it, you need to create a diversion rather than answer. Why is that?

          • Dreadnaught

            I trashed Western culture?

          • Albert

            You secularists. Can’t you see the problem here? The problem isn’t Islam. The problem is gutless Western vacuity, colluding with a doctrine of equality that prevents us from robustly identifying that basis of Western culture (and therefore the standard of culture we will expect from people coming here) as Christianity.

          • Dreadnaught

            You secularists. No; just me.

          • Albert

            I never said that – it’s one of the unfortunate elements of English: we have the same word “you” plural and singular. But there can be no doubting that our cultural identity is weaker now than ever before. Whose watch did this happen on?

          • Little Black Censored

            Homogeneous.

      • PessimisticPurple

        Yes, He really went to bat for Stalin’s Russia.

        • Dreadnaught

          ?. I must be missing something quite profound I’m sure.

          • The Explorer

            Too astute for me.

          • Ivan M

            “god” fought for Stalin.
            “god” fought for Hitler.

            God fights on the side of the bigger artillery – Napoleon.

          • Mike Stallard

            I was told by a Russian that Stalin abandoned his atheism during the war. He was, of course, a seminarist when he lost his faith. But during the war, he really did regain it. Then he lost it when the hostilities ended.
            That good Catholic boy Adolf, however, was not really a good example of the faith.

          • Ivan M

            But during the war, he really did regain it. Then he lost it when the hostilities ended.
            No atheists in foxholes – JV Stalin version

            That good Catholic boy, Schicklgruber killed off a few thousand priests and nuns in Dachau and other places. He even had a plan to kidnap the Pope.

          • PessimisticPurple

            And not for the first time, I’ll wager.

          • Dreadnaught

            And not for the last I’ll warrant and Certainly with your current standard of opacity.

    • Ivan M

      Daesh can be reclassified as being mentally deranged.

    • Anton

      It’s propaganda, of course. If I want the truth about Islam I go to the quran and hadith. But they doesn’t reassure me.

  • chefofsinners

    Some good news midst all this gloom…
    A 52-year-old man of Turkish descent who was stabbed in the back in central London a few weeks ago has made a good recovery and is being looked after by staff at the Foreign Office.
    The assailant, who fled the scene screaming “my wife made me do it” seems to have gone to ground.

  • PessimisticPurple

    He’s now being reported as a “Norwegian national of Somali origin”.

    • Royinsouthwest

      Well, you know the reputation of the Vikings!

  • From henceforth any violent act against another by any person from a Muslim country or by any person with a Muslim sounding name, shall be deemed an act of terrorism.

    • The Explorer

      Don’t you mean a mental health issue that has nothing to do with Islam or terrorism?

    • CliveM

      So it would seem.

    • Ivan M

      What is the probability that a non-Muslim with mental issues would have committed this crime?

    • Merchantman

      What like FGM, Honour Killings, Group rape, etc?

  • Uncle Brian

    No wonder Debka File is so widely distrusted!

    … the attacker is a Muslim from Somalia
    What? Not a Norwegian? That can’t be right!

    The terrorist was said to have told investigators …
    What? A terrorist? Not a mental health case? That can’t be right either.

    http://www.debka.com/newsupdate/17416/printversion

    • Ivan M

      I am certain that everyone who heard that he was a Somali came to the same conclusion. It’s a no brainer.

    • bluedog

      Debka continues to excel. Always the best source of the truth and the least likely party to be fooled by state propaganda.

  • jsampson45

    “We used to be given names…” Oh? I thought the usual formula was “A man is helping the police with their enquiries (but not much)”.

  • Inspector General

    This is what happens when our quite wonderful Metropolitan Police are constantly brow beaten by worthless politicians for being racist in as much as they arrest black criminals. The police refuse to say a suspect caught in the act is black! Who could blame the individuals concerned, it could be a career damaging move for them…

    The Inspector has in mind one extremely mouthy negress who doesn’t miss a blasted trick…

    • Mike Stallard

      You are getting a bit dodgy here, honky. Pale, male and stale.

      • Inspector General

        This piece of poor white trailer trash begs your forgiveness, great black mother of her constituency…

        • Black Mama.

          • Inspector General

            …is a particularly unpleasant snake. Or is that black mamba…

  • Royinsouthwest

    Why should terrorism and mental derangement be mutually exclusive reasons? Do you have to pass a sanity test to become a terrorist?

  • Ivan M

    I read that the man who had the altercation with the Munich killer is to be charged. A clear case of mental derangement of state authorities brought about by the state cult of Holocaustianity.

  • Inspector General

    One wonders if ‘mental derangement’ is ever confused with quite normal behaviour to be expected from certain racial groups. The answer is Yes by the way. Never let it be said your Inspector ever beats around the bush…

  • The Explorer

    On this question of whether the knifeman is a Norwegian or a Somali, it’s difficult. To describe him as a Norwegian is probably technically correct, but without reference to ethnicity it’s misleading. There could presumably be the physical equivalent of Anders Breivik who has taken out citizenship and is living in Mogadishu, but it wouldn’t be the image you think of first if you hear the word ‘Somali’. And there seems to be a deliberate attempt by the MSM to blur ethnicity and nationality. .

    A while back, a Swedish woman was gang raped by five men. The Swedish media described the attackers as four Swedes and a Somali.

    In practice, they were five Somali immigrants: four with Swedish citizenship, and one without.

    • Ivan M

      In practice, they were five Somali…

      A latter day Jonathan Swift could not have topped this in an updated Gulliver’s Travels.

      • The Explorer

        The situation is genuinely confusing. The Munich gunman asserting that he was German (and the subsequent media reaction) is illustrative. Quite true: he was German.

        • Ivan M

          It is a more serious offence to be derogatory of race, than to be condemnatory of murder in Germany. A few dead: sad, but who really cares after a week? Not so with offences in the nature of thought crimes. That is heresy against the state cult, as the tattooed German finds out.

    • dannybhoy

      He’s a Somali living in Norway. It takes generations to really integrate, and some will prefer to simply remain citizens without ever integrating.
      If I was born in a garage it would not make me a car. If I was born in China, it would not make me Chinese. I would be a British child born in China…

      • Uncle Brian

        Apparently his family moved from Norway to Britain when he was about 4 or 5 and that’s where he has lived ever since.

        • dannybhoy

          So he’s a Norwegian citizen, but is he a Norwegian?

          • bluedog

            One awaits the announcement that he was inspired by Anders Breivic.

    • Inspector General

      He’s a black man. He could have been born in the Space Station and claim cosmic asylumn, but he’d still be a black man…

      • Anton

        Don’t care if he’s green with blue spots, what’s his religion?

        • Inspector General

          What’s yours…and don’t say a pint…

          • Anton

            Whisky, Inspector; we share a taste for single malts, if you recall.

      • The Explorer

        Mo Farah is representing Britain in the Olympics Is he British, or isn’t he?

        • Inspector General

          One does not concern himself with the games and circuses the lesser intellects delight in…

        • Pubcrawler

          Was Zola Budd? Greg Rusedski?

          • The Explorer

            Yes, it’s difficult. No wonder the Munich gunman was confused about who he was. Two further issues:

            1. Mo Farah was born in Mogadishu. What if he had been born in London?

            2. Greg R and Mo F were both born outside Britain, but Greg R has British ethnicity in a way that Mo F has not

            In the film ‘Mugabe and the White African, the black African who appropriates the white farm points out that there are no white Africans. It does not matter if you, and your parents and grandparents before you, were born in Africa, or if you are committed to the continent. If you are white, you are not African.

            I’m not saying he’s right, but he does express the ethnicity viewpoint very clearly.

          • Inspector General

            Biggest racists on Earth, the sub Saharan Africans. They murder their next door neighbours…

          • bluedog

            Yes, it’s true, People of Colour or PoCs as the Grauniad now describes them, cannot be racist. Certainly a Norwegian-Somali who slashes and kills whites is not racist but protesting against the legacy of western colonialism, or something.

        • Anton

          The question is incomplete until you define “British”, of course…

          • Dominic Stockford

            1. Someone who Iives in Britain….

            Ah, he spends most of his time in the US training… so define ‘lives’…

            Can’t win at that one! I’m not going any further.

          • The Explorer

            In ‘Brave New World’ there’s Mustapha Mond and Polly Trotsky: Britain is simply the geographical location of representatives from every race, tribe, nation, ethnicity or whatever from round the globe.

            That’s where we’re headed if we aren’t there already. You’re British, whatever your ethnic origin, if you were born here, or if you’ve lived in Britain long enough, and for enough days in a year, to acquire British citizenship, and have done so.

    • IanCad

      Adoption of citizenship does not confer a change in nature.

  • Mike Stallard

    Pity the same anonymity was not extended to Sir Cliff Richard.

    • dannybhoy

      Cliff is a victim of abuse at the hands of South Yorkshire Police and a voyeuristic BBC…

      • Anton

        Whom he is suing. I hope he wins.

        • dannybhoy

          Me too although I suspect “the taxpayer” may insist they settle out of court…

      • Royinsouthwest

        The South Yorkshire Police spent the best part of two decades ignoring sexual abuse of white girls in Rotherham by men with a certain background. The BBC spent just as long if not longer ignoring crimes by Jimmy Saville. Could that explain why both organisations were so keen on publicising the raid on Cliff Richard’s house?

  • Pubcrawler

    OT: So, Shameless Chakrabarti gets her reward:

    http://order-order.com/2016/08/04/corbyn-gives-shami-peerage-anti-semitism-whitewash/

    Anyone surprised?

  • Dreadnaught

    According to DMOL he’s been here 14 years and gone through the English schools system. So he’s really more British and Norwegian or Somalian. It would be more informative to know which Mosk or School he actually attended.

    • Pubcrawler

      “So he’s really more British”

      Ah, like Mo Farah.

      • Dreadnaught

        Wonder why no one ever calls him Mohammad Farah – not.

      • dannybhoy

        Yes, but Mo Farah is proud to be British and so far has shown no inclination to stab his fellow competitors…

        • Pubcrawler

          This other chap might be proud to be British, too. As, presumably, is Thomas Mair.

          • dannybhoy

            But Thomas Mair has mental health problems, but that doesn’t excuse him for attacking and killing the MP.

          • Dreadnaught

            That’s just a rouse – he knew well beforehand and why he killed that MP.

        • DP111

          But he is a devout Muslim, and must believe that Sharia must be the law everywhere.

          If not, then he is an apostate, and I dont see any evidence of that.

          So what we have is a silent Sharia supporter, using the wealth and fame he has because of the West, to propagate Sharia.

  • dannybhoy

    The mental health scandal: ‘Fear in the Community’
    Government Health Warning: Knives may damage your health. Mind where you go!

    • Inspector General

      You wag, sir!

      • dannybhoy

        Pretty sharp huh?

    • Uncle Brian

      … may shorten your life

  • Anton
    • Inspector General

      Blimey, his name alone is enough to scare anyone shitless…

      • What? Lost your trusty Stanley knife?

    • Merchantman

      Blimey that was hard for them, like pulling teeth.

  • Inspector General

    There’s definitely a need to tighten up on asylum applications. Before asylum itself is properly binned. The Inspector himself suggests this all important question added for the would be’s….

    “Are you being persecuted in your homeland because you like to kill people?”

    • The Explorer

      For some countries, that should read, “”Are you being persecuted in your homeland because you DON’T like to kill people?”

      • Inspector General

        Let’s just abolish asylum. It was meant for men of genuine conscious in opposition to oppression. Not for thicko families and their murderous offspring…

        • And we could lock up all the mentally ill as in days gone by.

          • Inspector General

            Who’s to say he’s mentally ill, and not just another black armed with a knife and annoyed for some reason…

          • Well then, lock up or deport all non-whites too.

        • Merchantman

          Yes scrap the whole thing. So 20th Century. Time to move on.

        • Bob Frost

          The original 1951 convention was initially limited to protecting European refugees from before 1 January 1951, a finite problem.

          The 1967 protocol removed the time limits and applied to refugees “without any geographic limitation” and has become a sort of round robin, signed by 146 states, many of which the refugees are actually fleeing from, and most of whom take little if any notice of it.

          I believe that Japan last year had about 5000 applications and accepted 17.

          We now have 65.3 million people worldwide displaced from their homes by conflict and persecution ALL of whom would fulfill the criteria to be granted Asylum if they managed to get to the UK!

          Fortunately few of the poor bastards have any hope of getting here but it is rank hypocrisy to pretend we would grant them all refugee status if they did.

          It is no longer fit for purpose.

          • Inspector General

            Thanks for that.

  • Albert

    From the Guardian:

    Jo Loughran, interim director of Time to Change, the mental health anti-stigma campaign run by Mind and Rethink Mental Illness, has urged the media to ensure any reporting of a mental health element to the Russell Square attacks is “informed and balanced”. She points out that the overwhelming majority of people with mental health problems will never pose a risk to others. She said:

    We understand that the police have released an update about the tragic incident at Russell Square stating that mental health is an increasingly significant factor in this case. The media must rightly report on this angle but we encourage them to do so responsibly.

    There have been a number of horrendous acts of violence committed across Europe over recent weeks. As the media look to unpick these extremely complex incidents to explore motivations and reason we urge journalists and editors to provide well informed and balanced coverage of mental health.

    Millions of people experience mental health problems every year and the overwhelming majority will never pose a risk to others.

    Quite.

    • Not forgetting:
      Millions of people practice Islam every year and the overwhelming majority will never pose a risk to others.

      • Inspector General

        …to other practising muslims of the same sect, you meant to say….

      • The Meissen Bison

        But is the risk posed by the minority, small as a proportion of the whole but nonetheless significant in number, sufficiently serious as to require that steps be taken to defend against them?

        • Do you mean the mentally ill or Islamist terrorists?

      • Merchantman

        What about the damage caused to their self and family?

        • Compared to atheists and secularists, you mean?

          • Merchantman

            We are discussing the peculiar drivers from exposure to various forms of Islam, aren’t we?
            I mean we cant be sure, but I doubt this peson is an atheist or secularist.

          • No, and you don’t know what form of Islam, if any, he was exposed to.

          • Merchantman

            No we don’t. Its written you see and that’s what counts.

      • dannybhoy

        I agree but it does seem to depend on the cultural application of the faith. For example in some Islamic countries FMG and honour killings loom large, in others the rigid application of Shari’a in matters like adultery, homosexuality and rape..
        Then there is the tribal warfare prevalent in Afghanistan, no education for women etc. And of course the treatment, abuse and persecution of minority religious groups in countries such as Egypt and Pakistan and Nigeria…

      • len

        Only themselves..

  • Probably been chewing too much khart.

    • chefofsinners

      Nowadays opium is the religion of the masses. Mental health problems are never far behind.
      Meanwhile research shows that religion is good for mental health, although only if you view God as loving and kind.

      • Ah, that’s where Carl goes wrong then.

        • carl jacobs

          Don’t quit your day job.

  • Three men leapt from a vehicle yesterday in Spikes Bridge Road, Southall, and hacked Gurinder Singh, 33, to death.

    Police later reported they had arrested “a 24-year-old man” on suspicion of murder and he was being questioned in custody at a north London police station. No name given; no ethnic details provided; no religion stated; and no country of origin identified.

    Another cover up?

    • The Explorer

      If ageism, sexism and racism are all bad, why mention his age and his gender? Surely these should be privileged as much as his race? “A human has been arrested.” No, that won’t do: speciest. “An arrest has been made” should suffice

      • Earth creature is the appropriate term.

        • Uncle Brian

          You’ll find people who’ll say that discriminates against aliens. To be on the safe side, best stick with “an organism”.

          • Linus may read that word quickly and misunderstand.

  • The Explorer

    An incidental question occurs to me. His parents emigrated first to Norway, and then to Britain when he was four.
    Had he been Danish, say, no problem: EU nationals moving from one EU state to another. But Norway isn’t in the EU. So there’s the same freedom of movement within Europe whether you’re in the EU or out of it? Or is that only by agreement between the EU and outsiders? It’s all very confusing.

    • Pubcrawler

      I think EFTA, of which Norway is a member, provides for free movement of people. I know Norwegians who are long-term UK residents, and Brits who either have lived in Norway, or still do, and no extra paperwork was required for them to do so, IIRC.

      • The Explorer

        That clarifies. Thank you.

  • Dominic Stockford

    As a former worker in the area of Mental Health it is important to note two things. One is that most people with mental health issues hurt other people with mental health issues – it’s the way it goes, on the occasions it does. Secondly, ‘insanity’ is used, even within the mental health fraternity, because non-Christians find it impossible to accept the reality of evil (a matter which is logical, though undermining of any attempts to deal with it). I was frequently looked at askance when I raised it as a real effect on people’s behaviour.

    • dannybhoy

      Pretty tricky to introduce the possibility of evil as a cause of serious mental health. I remember years ago belonging to a small church wherein was a wife who had been suffering awful depression for years.
      Our fellowship ‘diagnosed’ it as oppression and so she was the subject of much prayer, repentance and er. deliverance.
      Then a doctor began treating her with lithium….
      http://www.uptodate.com/contents/unipolar-depression-in-adults-treatment-with-lithium

      Comments?

      • Dominic Stockford

        I was trying to say that while some people do things because they have mental health problems, others simply commit evil. The msm and non-christians conflate the two, putting them all in ‘mental health’. This suits them, but doesn’t address the truth.

        Clearer?

        • dannybhoy

          No no Dominic, I agreed completely with what you were saying, but I was just pointing out that sometimes we Christians can rush in with a diagnosis that causes unnecessary suffering and makes us look foolish. It’s better to eliminate the simpler, rational, medical approach first.
          I have met people whose behaviour and antagonism I would suspect of being demonic, but I don’t think it’s as widespread as some suggest. It could be for example that some (obviously not all), of the people Jesus dealt with were mentally ill. But He healed them anyway.

          • Dominic Stockford

            He did, indeed.

            And then Paul, directed directly by the Holy Spirit pointed out to us (a reiteration of Old Testament teaching) that:
            “whatever does not proceed from faith is sin.” Romans 14:23.

            Is ‘mental health’ a simpler, rational explanation? Or is it simply that we today are happier to put less weight on good and evil, and the battle between the two that rages, because the world just won’t have it, and we don’t wish to be castigated by it?

            ‘Mad’ people do ‘mad’ things, but they also do bad things which have no relationship to their ‘madness’. Bad people just do bad things.

      • CliveM

        To many people today still don’t think of mental illness as being a ‘proper’ illness like cancer or heart decease etc. Frankly from experience of what has happened to people I know, some charismatic churches have done real damage with their approach.

        • dannybhoy

          I agree with you Clive, but then I don’t believe we are all born as God would have us be either. He loves us regardless of our imperfections, not because He ordained that we should have them.

          • CliveM

            Agree DB, and some people are born with the propensity for mental illness already in them.

            Then some clown in a church tries to convince them it’s a demon! Thankfully it is rare and almost non existent outside of the Charismatic Movement.

        • Anton

          I agree. But some other charismatic churches have done real good.

    • Uncle Brian

      Lower down this thread, Albert has posted a clipping from the Grauniad in which an NGO called Time to Change, described as “a mental health anti-stigma campaign”, complains about the use of “mental health issues” as a euphemism or linguistic camouflage for Muslim terrorism. But if the media go along with the complaint and amend their language accordingly, they’re going to be casting around for a new camouflage. I wonder what they’ll come up with.

      • Dominic Stockford

        I think that even if ‘people’ charged into the Grauniad offices firing randomly whilst screaming ‘we’re doing this for Allah!’ at the tops of their voices, the next days paper would find another hat for the actions.

      • Dreadnaught

        Tagging this bastard with ‘a get out of jail free’ mental health label is actually stigmatising others who have committed no offence even while debilitated by genuine MH problems. They are the ones being dragged into distancing themselves by this linguistic perversion that benefits no one but the perpetrator and subsequent imitators.

  • ZX10

    Well the BBC and Met have done a great stich???sorry -service as we now don’t have to bother with a criminal trial, after conducting the case for the defense we can just send him to a secure [lol?] place where he can live out his short non sentence until a Lord Longford wannabe sets him loose again !

  • DP111

    The police state that there is no connection to terrorism.

    Apparently they couldn’t find a fully paid up ISIS ID card on the Norwegian of “Somali culture” or something.

    This is the state of affairs we are in. There is no doubt that
    treating Jihad as a mental health problem is an agreed policy throughout
    the West. They cannot say the truth, that these attacks in the West are
    taking place by Muslims who have been allowed in, and who are following
    the commands of the Koran and Hadiths.

    Admitting that would mean that the political elite have put the West
    into an existential crisis, that is, one that can destroy Western
    civilisation. For such a crime, hanging would be too benign.

    And this is why no one can be allowed to comment on the truth of the
    Emperor’s cloak. That is why we have speech codes, hate speech “crimes”,
    and possibly “thought” crimes in the future. For such “crimes” , the
    speaker will lose his job, vilified by the mass media, and possibly put
    in jail where there are large number of Muslims. A fate that befell
    Tommy Robinson.

    • Dominic Stockford

      Evil is as evil does. Calling it by another name changes nothing, and does those with genuine mental health problems no favours.

      • The Explorer

        I think it was Socrates who said no one does evil knowingly. Evil arises from ignorance. Utopians have developed this. The key to virtue is education (preferably funded with someone else’s money.)

        Conan Doyle saw it differently. The villain in ‘Baskervilles’ is an ex-educationist. So is the villain in ‘The Musgrave Ritual’. Then there’s Professor Moriarty. Knowledge is no guarantee of virtue: it may simply enable evil to be carried out more efficiently.

        Reality is on the side of Conan Doyle. Goebbels had a doctorate. One of the concentration camp commandants had two doctorates in jurisprudence. Another, God help us, had a doctorate in divinity. Thinking of some theologians, that should come as no surprise.

    • Anton

      You are right, except that Tommy Robinson should not be held as a role model. Criticising Islam is not the only way he has come to the attention of the law. To get traction, anti-sharia movements must be led by blameless people.

    • Coniston

      I have been re-reading ‘Time for Truth’ by Oz Guinness (pub. 2000), in which he points out that post-modernism has resulted in many people creating their own ‘reality’. With no belief in objective truth or reality, everyone can believe in what they like and create their own ‘truth’ and ‘reality’. This certainly explains why the western political class and media have lost touch with reality, and try to force their fantasies on everyone else. It is what Alasdair MacIntyre called the emotivist, manipulative society, in which those with the power enforce their views on everyone else. This insanity is growing and is likely to destroy the West.

  • nemesis

    Interesting is it not that when a mentally ill man murdered Joe Cox the immediate outcry was that he was a Brexit/Racist. When a Muslim man commits an atrocity he is not really a muslim – just mentally unstable.
    You should check this out; http://heatst.com/world/exclusive-did-ill-suspect-of-somali-descent-in-uk-attack-study-terror/

  • Dreadnaught
    • Uncle Brian

      Does anybody believe it? I don’t think so. There are people who pretend to believe it, that’s all.