Corbyn Jewish Chronicle 2
Extremism

Is Jeremy Corbyn an anti-Semitic Israel hater?

 

Jeremy Corbyn has a few questions to answer. They have been posed by The Jewish Chronicle, iterated by the Daily Mail, reiterated by the Guardian and re-reiterated by the Campaign Against Antisemitism. They would be important concerns for any elected politician to be asked to address, let alone one who (it seems) is about to be elected Leader of HM Loyal Opposition.

Essentially, Jeremy Corbyn seems to enjoy fellowship with Jew-hating anti-Semites, conspiracy theorists, murderers, Israel-haters, Holocaust-deniers and sundry other terrorists and extremists. But it is averred that there’s nothing wrong in that..

 
Meeting terrorists

 
But surely there’s a distinction to be drawn between the unavoidable clammy hands one is obliged to shake in a world of realpolitik and diplomatic matters of state, and the obnoxious undesirables with whom one voluntarily associates, to the point of proclaiming what a “pleasure and honour” it is to host “our friends”, when those friends have murdered, tortured, maimed and terrorised countless thousands of innocent people, if not unknown tens of thousands in the pursuit of their political objectives. “Our friends from Hezbollah”? “Our friends from Hamas”? If the future leader of the Labour Party will not condemn the IRA, what response will he make to the Islamic State? “Women are raped, men are tortured and children slaughtered on both sides?” Would he share a platform with Nigel Farage and declare what a “pleasure and honour” it is to host “our friends from Ukip”?

Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners (1 Cor 15:33).

I have not sat with vain persons, neither will I go in with dissemblers.
I have hated the congregation of evil doers; and will not sit with the wicked (Ps 26:4f).

Make no friendship with an angry man; and with a furious man thou shalt not go:
Lest thou learn his ways, and get a snare to thy soul (Prov 22:24f).

It would be a grave error to assume that Jeremy Corbyn’s associations and entanglements are a result of hasty or simplistic political judgment. There is something more intricate about his ideological consistency which is inseparable from his political office. As an obscure backbencher, perhaps it didn’t matter. But as HM Leader of the Opposition and putative prime-minister-in-waiting, it is of profound importance.

If Jewishness is a problem for Jeremy Corbyn, and the existence of Israel a cause of offence, what response can he credibly make to those who are driven from their synagogues, spat on in the streets, harassed outside the school gates or kidnapped and murdered in their sleep, simply for wearing a kippa? What can he say to the relatives of those whose gravestones are desecrated with faeces or defaced by Nazi swastikas? How can the leader of HM Loyal Opposition speak peace to Jewish leaders while engendering polemics and hostility toward them, their religion, their heritage and their ancestors?

Do not rich men oppress you..? (Js 2:6).

His eyes have seen the glory of the coming of Karl Marx.
He is trampling out the bankers where the people’s wealth is stored..

In the pursuit of political integrity, conviction and socialist authenticity, are Labour Party members (and ‘affiliated supporters’) really about to elect an anti-Semite to the Opposition frontbench of Parliament, and thereby release a plague of Jew-hating protocols and affirm hordes of Islamist-adoring votaries? Are they about to set free all those who seek any and every social or economic reason for believing the age-old Jewish conspiracy? Are they really intent on crippling the party which preaches the virtues of social justice, community cohesion and equality, in favour of a degenerative cult of anti-Zionist venom and “our friends from Hezbollah”?

  • scidbox

    “our friends”, when those friends have murdered, tortured, maimed and terrorised countless thousands of innocent people, if not unknown tens of thousands in the pursuit of their political objectives..

    Here do you refer to UK political organisations who have special relations with Israel? I ask as, yes, Israel has – murdered, tortured, maimed and terrorised countless thousands of innocent people, if not unknown tens of thousands in the pursuit of their political objectives..- over the past 48 years and continue to do so.
    Maybe this is why people have a problem with Israel and her policies, not antisemetism which is oh so easy to claim.

    Shalom.

    • Sam

      Except Hamas and other jihadists are antisemitic, look at their charter. I note your utter failure to condemn those who want nothing other than a Jew free middle east, genocide not beyond the pale for these groups to obtain that idea and who are not interested in peace (or even a two state solution), but who will do nothing but use terrorism to attack Israel . These groups whose ideology is not only antisemitic, but which also oppresses women, strings gays from cranes and persecutes Christians.

    • IanCad

      This is ridiculous! Israel with under 9 million of souls has physical borders with Muslim nations totaling around 125 million. Sure, not all want to slit throats, but most want Israel gone.
      Now, if you add all the other Islamic states in the region; Arabia, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Turkey, North and Sub-Saharan Africa; we add yet more 100’s of millions.
      We are a sporting people. We like fair play and root for the underdog. Politics aside – it takes a pretty low wretch indeed who would cheer the Islamic world to the hurt of Israel.

    • Dominic Stockford

      I have looked at your discus profile – all your comments, every single one, is anti-Israel. Notable that you appear here out of the blue and make another one.

    • Inspector General

      Care to substantiate your claim with examples? One example, even. The criteria is quite straight forward. Anything Israel has done that was not in response to some atrocity committed by your side. After all, you have “countless thousands of innocent people, if not unknown tens of thousands” to choose from. Of course, if they are so ‘unknown’ you might not be able to…

    • Owl

      Pure crap.

  • Anton

    Je suis Israel.

    • Je suis Labour Party, more like.

      • Sam

        Dude

        As an old Labour socialist chap, how will you vote? Kendall for the legs?

        • Anton

          I’m not Labour but stop reading my mind.

        • All the candidates have legs, Sam.

          • Sam

            Yeah, but Liz is hotter that Yvette….

          • CliveM

            A month old corpse is hotter the Yvette. Not a recommendation though.

      • Anton

        Moi? Jamais! Pourquoi dis-tu ca?

  • Mark

    Corbyn’s associations are completely indefensible, particulalry in these times of extremism. I doubt I need to hear from him, what he thought about the Birmingham schools intrusion, because I reckon I can work that out for myself. The same regarding the Charlie Hebdo affair. We seem to be starting to talk a bit tougher at government level about extremism, so the last thing we need is someone with a view that we’d have to listen to their grievances, because we’re at fault in the first place.

  • David

    Your Grace asks some very essential questions.
    I know nothing about this contender, only this sudden rush of information which I instinctively mistrust, as the temptation to speak spin must be immense, during this leadership struggle.
    But if even some of these allegations are half-true, I then it fills me with foreboding. An anti-Jewish leader of the Labour Party could lead to terrible things.
    My God, how much faster can the country plunge down the slope ?

  • Dominic Stockford

    The simple answer, given the wealth of evidence from interviews and factual records, is that Labour members are indeed about to elect someone who shouldn’t be holdng political office, let alone have been elected as an MP, because of his views and his ideology. The real problem is that many of those electing him think his views are perfectly acceptable.

  • Johnny Rottenborough

    when those friends have murdered, tortured, maimed and terrorised

    Lest we forget, The Occidental Observer draws attention to the ‘British Casualties of Jewish Terrorism’. The article quotes a letter by the playwright Ben Hecht to the terrorists: ‘Every time you blow up a British arsenal, or wreck a British jail, or send a British railroad-train sky high, or rob a British bank, or let go with your guns and bombs at the British betrayers and invaders of your homeland, the Jews of America make a little holiday in their hearts.’ Likewise the Jews of Britain, doubtless.

    Are they really intent on crippling the party

    If Labour has any sense, it will position itself as the party of Britain’s fastest growing electorate, the Muslims. To that end, a coolness towards Jews will boost, not cripple, Labour’s fortunes and is only to be expected in the diverse society Jews insist is essential for their safety: ‘Jews are safe only in a society acceptant of a wide range of attitudes and behaviors, as well as a diversity of religious and ethnic groups.’ [The Culture of Critique, page 244]

    • Sam

      “Likewise the Jews of Britain”.

      Boll#cks. You are so blinded by your far right fantasy world and hate of anything Jewish.

      1). British Jews (and Canadian, New Zealand, Australian, Indian etc) fought & died in two world wars for Britain.

      2).The Jewish chronicle at the time of the mandate was critical of Jewish terrorism and condemned it.

      3). As are Jews today , e.g. a couple of weeks ago when Jewish terrorists burnt a church down and also by the death of a Palestinian baby in a different incident . The result was massive protests in Israel, organised by ordinary Jewish Israelis, but also attended by the Israeli president. Unlike Palestinians there were no celebrations, sweets handed out or blanket bigotry.

      4). Quoting the McDonald culture of critique again I see : this being a discredited “academic” book used as if it were gospel. Look McDonald might be seen as the messiah to the classic neo Nazi or far right brigade, but basically he comes out with a load of old tropes about Jews, which belong to the nineteenth century or 1930s Germany ,but tries to give it the veneer of academic credibility. Unfortunately far right loons, Klan members and other conspiracy nutters think it is fact. Being literate might help them.

      • CliveM

        Good response.

      • Johnny Rottenborough

        @ Sam—British Jews fought & died in two world wars for Britain
        If Jews were not in reserved occupations, their only choices were to serve or register as conscientious objectors. The same as everybody else but only the Jews make a song and dance out of it.

        The Jewish Chronicle was critical of Jewish terrorism
        A wise move. Saved its office being razed to the ground.

        As are Jews today
        The latest round-up of anti-Christian attacks in Israel.

        Quoting the MacDonald Culture of Critique again
        No, quoting the American Jew Charles Silberman.

        • Anton

          Sam might mean the 30,000 Jewish volunteers for British armed forces from Palestine during WW2.

          • Johnny Rottenborough

            @ Anton—I very much hope we gave them all a medal and a slice of gefilte fish.

          • Anton

            Regarding those anti-Christian attacks in Israel, by the way, it is still much safer to be a Christian in the Jewish-run parts of the Holy Land than in the Arab-run parts.

          • Dominic Stockford

            And you’re allowed to believe the Bible there without being called a bigot…

          • Sam

            Kiss my ass.

          • Anton

            The ones who died for Britain would not have been able to accept.

          • Johnny Rottenborough

            @ Anton—The 20-year-old British sergeants hanged with piano wire (see the first link in my first comment) would also have had some difficulty accepting.

          • Anton

            I know. And about the King David Hotel. Don’t think I approve. But don’t ignore context either.

          • CliveM

            These were brave men, makbelittles you.ing a snide joke doesn’t belittle them, it

          • Johnny Rottenborough

            I hope your speech impediment takes a turn for the better.

          • CliveM

            I’ve corrected my post, when are you going to correct yours?

          • Sam

            Sam refers to all those Jews in the UK, the commonwealth and america who fought and died against fascism and discovered the ultimate consequences of Jews not having a state for themselves. He is also upset that the likes of Johnny are still spreading the manure, even after that.

          • CliveM

            Sam

            There is nothing that can be done about people like JR, they are not interested in evidence. You are right to highlight to others the nonsense however.

          • Sam

            Clive

            Sadly that may be true. But the tragedy is that Johnny is an articulated man who possesses intelligence and or abilities to argue without being a thug to some degree. That’s what makes me sad and angry at the same time.

          • Inspector General

            Don’t be sad, Sam. Appreciate JR for the honesty with which he posts here. One appreciates honesty, even if politicians do not.

          • Sam

            He believes his crap if that’s what you mean.

          • Inspector General

            The point being that he broadcasts his malevolence. We can all see what he has to offer. How many up ticks can you see?
            Steady yourself and continue forward, you have the high ground…

          • DanJ0

            It’s also an alternative viewpoint, presented here calmly every so often, and that’s worth having even if one profoundly disagrees with it, I’d say. It’s the essence of the value of freedom of speech that unpopular views can be heard and argued against and dismissed. That’s better than not hearing them at all, I’d say.

          • Inspector General

            Absolutely DanJ0. That he be allowed to post here without censure from our host is the very stuff of freedom. And of course, we cannot know good unless bad is around in the background.

            Having said that, we must have discipline of sorts, and Linus’ all too apparent wrecking tactics look to have cost him his voice here. Again, Cranmer is to be applauded for the patience he had shown him. Patience being a finite quality.

          • Sam

            Dude

            Point taken…

          • CliveM

            Yes I understand. I’m not suggesting ignoring him, simply not to get to wound up by it.

          • Sam

            Dude

            Indeed.

          • CliveM

            Also conspiracy theory crap gives a feeling of power and exclusive knowledge for the individual, in an otherwise tedious and pointless existence.

        • Darter Noster

          “If Jews were not in reserved occupations, their only choices were to serve or register as conscientious objectors. The same as everybody else but only the Jews make a song and dance out of it.”

          Bullshit. 10,000 plus Jews, from both long-established English and recently arrived immigrant families, were serving with the colours by early 1916, BEFORE compulsory registration and conscription. Most of those who had arrived since the 1870s had been forced to flee Russia by pogroms, but they STILL volunteered to fight for Britain in support of Russia.

          The Jewish Chronicle constantly ran the slogan: ‘England has been all she could be to Jews, Jews will be all they can be to England’, though doubtless you will dismiss this as a cunning survival strategy that they didn’t really mean, since to pea-brained bigots like yourself Jews can do nothing right.

          If Jews and others do make a song and dance about it, it is only because their right to exist in this country (or anywhere else for that matter) and their ability to be British are constantly questioned and denied by anti-Semitic idiots. In any case, the BBC and others bang on a hell of a lot more about the black, Asian and Muslim contributions to Britain’s war efforts than they do about the Jewish ones.

          Israel spends 70 years providing the only safe-haven in the Middle East that Christians have, and then just because a few arseholes get out of hand and commit terrorism, suddenly the Jewish plot to destroy Christianity is proved!

          People like you want their heads examining.

          • Johnny Rottenborough

            @ Darter Noster—Before we get too carried away, 10,000 was 2·8 per cent of the Jewish population in 1914.

            Ah, the pogroms. Fact or fiction? This article quotes heavily from John Klier’s book, Russians, Jews and the Pogroms of 1881-82.

            In 1961, the Jewish Chronicle editorialized: ‘all restrictions on immigration are in principle retrogressive steps, particularly for this country, and a disappointment to those throughout the world who would like to see the limitations on the freedom of movement reduced rather than increased. The issue is one of moral principle.’ [The Culture of Critique, page 300] Jews being ‘all they can be to England’ seems to involve reducing the English to a minority and using Islam to wipe out Christianity. If it’s all the same, we’d rather they didn’t bother.

            You see, I have answered your comment in a perfectly civilized way, with no name-calling. Please try to follow suit. Many thanks.

          • Sam

            New low . Johnny denies there ever was antisemitism or pogroms in Russia. What’s next? The protocols of the elders of Zion is fact? That the holocaust never took place?

          • Darter Noster

            “Ah, the pogroms. Fact or fiction? This article quotes heavily from John Klier’s book, Russians, Jews and the Pogroms of 1881-82.”

            The article you link to is pure, unadulterated crap, which I guess I should have expected from a site which has “White identity” on it’s banner head. In the course of that article Klier is portrayed as systematically refuting the idea of pogroms at all. He does nothing of the sort; the book goes into extensive details of massive atrocities against Jews across Russia. Klier was a highly-respected international scholar of Russian-Jewish history, and to use his work like that to produce biased, deliberately deceitful anti-Semitic crap for the sort of white-power wishful-thinking sites that you are incapable of distinguishing from genuine scholarship is nothing short of an affront to his memory.

            That article is a brilliant example of how to make bad, biased research look superficially plausible. For example, the article states:

            “Only with the decade-long research of John Klier has some revision of this narrative, grounded in scholarship and archival evidence, been possible. In light of this evidence, one can only conclude that stories of rape, murder and mutilation were “more legendary than factual.””

            Klier says absolutely nothing of the sort. He presents hundreds of pages of evidence and analysis of atrocities across Russia. What he actually says is:

            “A strong case can be made that the rape narrative that appeared in the West was, in fact, more legendary than factual. THIS PROBLEM WILL BE ADDRESSED IN THE COURSE OF THIS STUDY” (my emphasis – the quote is taken from the introduction, where he outlines the problems).

            The article does not quote “extensively” from Klier; it takes a tiny number of quotes, mostly from other people quoted by Klier himself, from an extremely small and selective portion of the book, and badly misuses them to make an anti-Semitic case. That is absolutely typical of ignorant crackpots from Holocaust deniers to Creation “Scientists”.

            Oh, and your statistic proves nothing either; the Jewish population would have included people in reserved occupations, children, old people, women, men unfit for service, and more recent immigrants not eligible for service. Many Jewish immigrants were from Germany and Austria-Hungary. The proportion of the total British population that joined by early 1916 was around 5.4%, whilst for Jews it was about 3.3 (approx 10,000 out of 300,000); by the end of the war the proportion of the Jewish population to have served was around 13.5% compared to around 11.5% of the British population. The difference is most likely due to the Jewish population being proportionately younger and in fewer reserved occupations.

            So you’ve answered nothing; all you’ve done is demonstrated that if I do use certain names, it is hardly without reason.

          • Johnny Rottenborough

            @ Darter Noster—Do you not like the idea of whites having an identity? I really think you should read the article more carefully, paying close attention to the reports compiled by the Consuls-General. The article’s sisters, parts 1 and 3, are also recommended.

          • Darter Noster

            I, as a white English person, have an identity and a culture of which I am proud; what I do not have is a pathetic racial persecution complex or a need to spread pseudo-intellectual racist theories. I resent these lunatics claiming to be the upholders of my racial and cultural identity; they do not speak for me or for the vast majority of white people, just as those terrorists do not speak for the vast majority of Israelis.

            Only one of us managed to spot the article’s total and unethical misuse of sources Johnny, which rather suggests I have read it a lot closer than you have.

          • Johnny Rottenborough

            @ Darter Noster—It isn’t evidence of a ‘racial persecution complex’ to heed Hugh Montefiore’s words of warning: ‘For a Jew to become a Christian is to go over to the enemy’. As a Jew who converted to Christianity, Montefiore had a greater understanding of the Jewish psyche than you or I. Christians who dismiss his warning are failing both their faith and their descendants.

            ‘Total and unethical misuse’. Gosh. Well, that’s The Occidental Observer dismissed with a wave of the hand. I do sympathize.

          • Pubcrawler

            “Hugh Montefiore’s words of warning: ‘For a Jew to become a Christian is to go over to the enemy’.”

            Have you read the rest of the chapter from which that sentence has been ripped, rendering it contextless? After a lengthy litany of the way that Christians have treated Jews throughout history (appallingly), he begins his summing up as follows:

            “I began this chapter by writing that when I became a Christian I went over to the enemy. How can any man or woman possibly doubt that the Church has been the enemy of the Jewish people once he or she knows the way in which the Christian Church has treated the Jewish people down the ages? Anyone who becomes a Jewish Christian has to bear in his soul a terrible burden of guilt as a member of a church which has not even apologised for what it has done in the past to his own Jewish people.”

            Hardly ‘words of warning’.

            Oh, and as someone who has known (and in one case inspired and assisted) a couple of Jews who have converted to Christianity, I think I have a greater understanding of the Jewish psyche than you do.

          • Darter Noster

            Not good at reading in context, is he?

          • CliveM

            Is he trying?

          • Pubcrawler

            In one way…

          • Pubcrawler

            He reads in the context of his prejudices. As do we all, of course, but some are more narrowly blinkered than others.

          • Johnny Rottenborough

            @ Pubcrawler—You could have saved yourself the trouble. The link I gave makes precisely those points: that Christians ‘have for centuries and centuries conceived an implacable hatred or dislike of [Jews, for] which they have never apologised.’ With Judaism preaching revenge, you bet Montefiore’s words are words of warning.

            By the way and incidentally, Jews have provoked ‘an implacable hatred or dislike’, otherwise known as anti-Semitism, wherever they have settled, which suggests the problem lies with Jews rather than non-Jews. The Jews pitch up, disadvantage the non-Jews, who then retaliate. Diversity doesn’t work, particularly when a community queens it, demanding special treatment—check out the American Jewish Committee’s definition of anti-Semitism.

          • Pubcrawler

            So you haven’t read the book.

          • Johnny Rottenborough

            @ Pubcrawler—From the review I linked: ‘That is pretty much all that Montefiore says about his conversion.’ Assuming that’s correct, the book has no further immediate usefulness for me. That Jews see Christians as the enemy is all I need to know. And not just Christians, either, but the white race in general: ‘The Census Bureau has just reported that about half of the American population will soon be non-white or non-European. We have tipped beyond the point where a Nazi-Aryan party will be able to prevail in this country.’ [Earl Raab, quoted on page 244 of The Culture of Critique]

            Earl couldn’t resist a little gloat: ‘It was only after World War II that [US] immigration law was drastically changed. In one of the first pieces of evidence of its political coming-of-age, the Jewish community had a leadership role in effecting those changes.’

          • Pubcrawler

            “Assuming that’s correct”

            And on that you base your interpretation of +Hugh’s words. I suppose it’s a hermeneutic of sorts…

          • Johnny Rottenborough

            @ Pubcrawler—I base my interpretation of Montefiore’s words on Montefiore’s words; they are crystal clear, after all. The rule about not being allowed to interpret a passage until the book has been read, marked, learned and inwardly digested is new to me.

          • Benjamin Waterhouse

            I suppose you will have to burn it now…

          • Johnny Rottenborough

            @ Benjamin Waterhouse—Very witty. In point of fact, if I had a copy of the book, I would put it in a glass case and throw sugar at it because it was Montefiore’s comment about Jewish enmity that opened my eyes to the Jews. To see the moment of revelation for yourself, go to this Cranmer blog and scroll down to ‘12 April at 18:28’.

          • Anton

            Montefiore will now have spoken to Jesus Christ, the man in whom he professed faith but whom he suggested in 1967 had homosexual tendencies.

          • Sam

            “Whites having an identity”

            I’ve got a brother in law who is British, white, Anglo Saxon with blue eyes. But he is Jewish as I with olive skin, black hair and brown eyes.

            I see you have finally resorted to type. Leave the racial stereotype at the BNP haunt you drink at.

        • Sam

          Bullshite alert

          “Song and dance”

          The point was a response to a guy , i.e. yourself , who was inferring that British Jews were traitors.

          “Raised to the ground”

          Which would be criminal and antisemitic at the same time. Nice of you to be in agreement with a pogrom.

          “Latest round up”

          1).Christians can go and live anywhere else in the middle east then and be free ? It’s not as if Israel isn’t tracking down these criminals is it? It’s not that Israeli civil society and people protest against acts against minorities?

          2). You don’t care about Christianity unless it’s a euphemism for whitey or if it is chance to bash Jews.

          3). You could suggest that the UK let the Israeli Christians come to the UK? But hey that’d mean letting more “wogs” in eh?

          “Not quoting McDonald”

          Yes you so all the time.

    • dannybhoy

      Interesting.

      Most people know about the Deir Yassin massacre and the King David Hotel bomb, but what many people don’t want to know is that these attacks were carried out not by the official Haganah (defence force) but by Etzel or the Irgun, the overall name given to the extremist groups intent on driving out the British and establishing a Jewish State.
      http://www.etzel.org.il/english/index.html

      Quite similar to the IRA in their tactics, but they operated outside of the constraints of the Haganah who strongly disapproved of their methods.

      One has to accept the bad stuff that was done in those days by these people. Not minimise it nor distort it.

      We also have to recognise that the Jews who had survived the Nazi German holocaust were dispossessed and had nowhere to go, and the settled Jews in Palestine offered the only real chance of safety and security.

      ‘Jews are safe only in a society acceptant of a wide range of attitudes
      and behaviors, as well as a diversity of religious and ethnic groups.’

      That probably was as a result of their experiences in Christian Europe…
      I can understand the reasoning without agreeing with it.

    • Anton

      It is worth asking why there were Jewish terrorist actions against the British. These took place in the Holy Land in the three years after World War 2. In 1939 the ‘MacDonald’ White Paper had slammed the gates of Palestine in the faces of Jews desperate to escape Hitler by severely limiting Jewish immigration there. The reason was, obviously, desire for Arab support in the war that was so clearly looming, but Winston Churchill spoke passionately against the White Paper in the Commons debate about it on 23rd May 1939, while the Permanent Mandates Commission of the League of Nations declared that “The policy set out in the White Paper is not in accordance with the interpretation which, in agreement with the Mandatory Power and the Council, the Commission has placed upon the Palestine Mandate.” Nevertheless the restrictions on Jewish immigration were put in place. During the War ben Gurion, leading the Jews of Palestine, wisely said that they would fight the war as if there were no White Paper, and fight the White Paper as if there were no war. Some 30,000 of them volunteered for British armed forces. (A smaller number is often quoted but that refers to specifically Jewish brigades formed late in the war.)

      After the war ended, the Jewish battle against the White Paper restrictions grew into occasional guerrilla actions, because Jews – many of whom had lost their pre-war homes in Europe – were still not permitted to migrate freely to Palestine. British policy was administered by Ernest Bevin, the Foreign Secretary in Clement Attlee’s Labour administration and no friend of the Jews. The USA supported migration of displaced European Jews to Palestine, and the 1946 Anglo-American Committee of Enquiry, aiming to coordinate policy, found a uniformly strong wish of European Jews for the option to migrate there. Many were homeless and came from lands that had collaborated in the Holocaust; in the summer of 1947 one ship carrying Holocaust camp survivors to Palestine, the Exodus, was turned back by the British. Its passengers were interned in – ironically – secure camps in occupied Germany. Many stateless Jews were dumped by the British in camps in Cyprus.

      As is well known, the British grew tired of occupying a land in which they no longer had much strategic interest after the war and withdrew, leading to fighting between Jew and Arab that gave rise to the modern State of Israel. Jamal Husseini, the Palestinian Arab leader, told the UN Security Council during the fighting: “The representative of the Jewish Agency told us yesterday that they were not the attackers, that the Arabs had begun the fighting. We did not deny this. We told the whole world that we were going to fight.”

      • dannybhoy

        Good post Anton, but I fear we are dealing with a man whose mind is made up..

      • “It is worth asking why there were Jewish terrorist actions against the British.”

        Is that (very one sided analysis) a justification of terrorism?

        King David Hotel bombing, Monday July 22, 1946. 91 dead; 46 injured.

        In 1946, The World Zionist Congress strongly condemned terrorist activities in Palestine and “the shedding of innocent blood as a means of political warfare”.

        • Anton

          Of course it isn’t. It is contextual information. As for one-sided, feel free to post further information.

        • Sam

          Oliver Cromwell was an English hero…

  • CliveM

    Well it’s clear he is anti Israel. But then he is also anti American, British and any one else who doesn’t buy into his Jewish conspiracy rubbish.

    You can judge a man by the company he keeps. But don’t doubt, for a large number of his voters, his pro-Arab, anti Israeli stance is part of the attraction.

    Welcome to Nu, New Labour.

  • Royinsouthwest

    Is Jeremy Corbyn and Anti-Semitic Israel Hater? , Yes, but not in comparison to George Galloway.

    • CliveM

      Better watch it, he’ll get his lawyers onto you. Likes his lawyers, bit like Maxwell that way.

  • James60498 .

    But then Mrs Balls wants buffer zones round all abortion clinics to stop protests. And how many deaths are they responsible for?

    Burnham would force faith schools be required to teach “gay relationships” as being equal.

    Which leaves Kendall. Don’t know much about her, except that she’s “the Blairite”

    I do not want in any way to belittle HG’s article. Clearly Corbyn is absolutely not fit to be Leader of the Opposition, never mind PM.

    But are any of the others?
    On either side? (Johnson, May, Osborne will be fighting out the Tory campaign before too long).

    It is said that you get the politicians that you deserve. What does that say about the nation?

    • dannybhoy

      “I do not want in any way to belittle HG’s article. Clearly Corbyn is
      absolutely not fit to be Leader of the Opposition, never mind PM.”
      He’d make an excellent funeral director though… :0)

    • Anton

      Nothing yet. But it says plenty about the Labour party.

      • James60498 .

        Cameron, leader of the Gay Rights Army is PM. Not only at home, but abroad too wherever he can bully other countries into following him

        Johnson serial adulterer and another gay rights soldier is Mayor of the Capital and a likely future PM.

        A Home Secretary who invents laws pretending to aim at extremist Muslims whilst knowing full well that they will be used against Christians.

        A weakening even further of the Abortion Laws under the coalition government sneaked through on Ministerial Order by the Health Secretary in the last Parliament.

        I am not sure that we need to wait until Labour are elected to wonder what the country has done to get the politicians it has.

        • Anton

          We were discussing Corbyn, and his prominence in the Labour leadership race reflects on the Labour Party. But if you wish to widen the discussion to the party that is currently in government then I entirely agree with what you say.

    • Benjamin Waterhouse

      That’s why a Christian cannot vote labour…

      • James60498 .

        But then my comment just below would also suggest to me at least that a Christian shouldn’t vote Conservative either.

        • Benjamin Waterhouse

          Certainly. there is no Tory party in this Sceptred Isle, just varieties of Mancunian Liberals. I’d vote for the Reactionary Party if there was one.

  • Inspector General

    A simple enough question you pose, Cranmer, that only Corbyn can truly answer. Perhaps he has. Is it not the case that a man is judged by the company he keeps? That which he voluntarily seeks after. People he can warm to and relax with.

    Pursuing policies pleasing to Islam is an interesting strategy to attract the home electorate with, don’t you think? Still, when said religion reminds us of its presence in England again, more sooner than later probably, he’ll join in the condemnation. At least, we hope he will…

    Dirty business, being of the hard left. But let’s not make too much of it until he is safely elected leader, eh? Mums the word, old fellow.

    Pip! Pip!

    • Dreadnaught

      …that only Corbyn can truly answer
      Have you taken leave of your senses IG man? You actually believe that a politician let alone a Loony Leftie like Corblimey can answer anything … truthfully? Mon Dieu, you appear to have mellowed to a deeper shade of old gold than Michael Fabricant’s festive straw wig.

      • Inspector General

        Well really! Does Dreadnaught not appreciate that a politician can give an answer without using his mouth to lie? They are at their most exposed then, and they do not like it. Like it they do not…

        • James60498 .

          I agree with you on the first point at least.

          Of course a politician can give an answer without using his mouth to lie.

          When he writes the answer.

        • CliveM

          You’ve got to love Dreadnoughts last sentence. Brilliant.

  • David

    For the avoidance of doubt : a personal slant.
    Did British Jews serve their country in her hour of need ?
    My late Dad was a soldier throughout WW2, a volunteer, who joined his artillery regiment in ’39. With his regiment they fought their way from the beaches of Dunkirk through to Berlin. Then he rejoined civvy street. One of his soldier friends was a Jew from London.

  • Dominic Stockford

    The simple answer, given the wealth of evidence from interviews and factual records, is that Labour members are indeed about to elect someone who shouldn’t be holdng political office, let alone have been elected as an MP, because of his views and his ideology.

    The real problem is that many of those electing him think his views are perfectly acceptable

  • bluedog

    Your Grace, there seems little doubt that Jeremy Corbyn is a BDS supporting anti-Semite, after all, both are core positions of the progressive Left in its current iteration.

    Paradoxically, these attributes mark Corbyn as an arch-conservative rather than the progressive that he would most likely claim to be. Corbyn’s version of socialism is a baby-boomer indulgence, a harking back to a long-lost youth of earnest protest and now, relevance regained. Corbyn’s proposal to re-nationalise industry is pure nostalgia and a belated revenge for Thatcherism.

    So it is with his support for Islamists, themselves regressives, not progressives, who seek to renounce modernity and implement the Wahhabism exported by Saudi Arabia for the past forty years. If you were to tell Corbyn that the final destination of his support for Hamas et al. was the dis-emancipation of women, the stoning to death of homosexuals and the end of innovation he would probably be speechless, for once.

    But where is the journalist with the capacity to understand this point and ask the questions? Certainly not to be found in the BBC.

    • Jawahar Gandhi

      Yes, you are right. Corbyn should side with the jews, who are so kind to the gentiles, particularly their children:

      http://forward.com/news/123925/rabbinic-text-or-call-to-terror/

      http://www.timesofisrael.com/5-of-ovadia-yosefs-most-controversial-quotations/

      • Anton

        Er, which Jews? What proportion do you think hold the views you link to?

      • Darter Noster

        So what’s your point? Some Jewish people are capable of being violent, hate-filled extremists? Well duh! So are people from every race, culture and faith.

        Boko Haram, Nusra Front, ISIS, Taleban, Al Qaeda – the list goes on and on. Across the world thousands upon thousands have been slaughtered, displaced, kidnapped, mutilated, subjugated and oppressed by Muslim militants, whilst preachers across Britain and other Western countries cheer them on, and some of the world’s most senior Islamic clerics in countries like Saudi Arabia and Egypt debate the theology of religious genocide and global conquest. And yet woe betide anyone who suggests publicly that this has anything to do with Islam, for Islam is a religion of peace, and all these people are not Muslims!

        A tiny number of Jewish extremists who are statistically insignificant compared to the global Jewish population, condemned and fought by the Israeli government, despised by most Israelis, and for whose actions the Israeli government and most people apologise, in contrast to the celebrations of the terror attacks against Israel, and all of a sudden the hate-filled eternal Jewish conspiracy is proved and centuries of racism and persecution are justified!

        And we’re supposed to be the deluded ones…?

        • Jawahar Gandhi

          But there is a big difference. Rabbi Ovadia Yosef was
          not a fringe Jew. He was the founder of a major political party, the Shas party. Also the politicians across the broad Israeli political spectrum revered him.

          http://www.jpost.com/National-News/Shas-spiritual-leader-Rabbi-Ovadia-Yosef-dies-at-93-328072

          Also can we say the same thing about the muslim extremists being a minority versus the jewish Islamophobic propaganda of a major muslim problem.

          Do Muslims Condone Terrorism?

          Wehave two types of terrorism: Causative and Reactionary.

          The Causative terrorism basically involves terrorising sections of the masses and communities of the world mainly through injustice, oppression, atrocities, massacres, genocide, occupation of their lands, destruction of their properties, laying their countriesdesolate, raping of their women, killing of their children and followed by their demonization and stigmatization through the controlled mainstream media, etc, etc. As such, causative terrorism,
          because of its nature, tends to be pursued by the state players like governments of the countries. Usually, the state players use the services of the mainstream media in spreading propaganda against their victims such that when they inflict atrocities, the brainwashed masses of those states say, well the victims deserved it.

          The Reactionary terrorism is usually adopted by the victims of the Causative terrorism. What happens is that a tiny section of the oppressed community is unable to bear the atrocities any more and as a result they go into utmost depression and finally become insane and start reacting violently against the agents of Causative terrorism.

          In the 20th & 21st century, the Muslims are the main victims of causative terrorism and while the muslim masses may try to discourage that tiny section resorting to reactionary
          violence, they are at a big loss to be effective because of the dilemma that there are hardly any courts of law in the world which can prosecute insane people successfully with prescribing of punishment.

          The only solution to total eradication of terrorism in the world is elimination of the causative terrorism.

          So, who are the state players pursuing causative terrorism. Well, you can judge for yourself by noting who invaded/occupied countries/regions: Palestine, parts of countries surrounding Palestine (Golan heights,
          Sinai, Lebanese border, etc), Afghanistan, Iraq, Sudan, Libya and currently Syria with Iran the next target and previously Chechnya, Bosnia, etc.

          • carl jacobs

            Terrorism is a form of asymmetrical warfare. The purpose of your (nonsensical) “causative/reactive” distinction is simply to justify its use by a favored group. As in “The Israelis made me blow up the bus with a bomb. It’s all their fault!”

        • dannybhoy

          Good post.
          “Some Jewish people are capable of being violent, hate-filled extremists?
          Well duh! So are people from every race, culture and faith.”
          The Jews have their rogues and criminals and ‘not nice’ people like any other nation.
          What people – especially high minded, idealistic, humanistic and liberal people – forget is the treatment of Jews and Christians in Muslim countries. Islam can tolerate the “people of the book living amongst them provided they pay the appropriate taxes and accept that they will never be full citizens and that their daily security is dependent on the Muslim government..
          This is part of the reason why the Jews moved most of their people into Israel. As there are no truly Christian countries any more, persecuted Christians have been left to fend for themselves… :0(
          Israel’s actions and policies have to be seen in the context of the attitudes of surrounding States towards her very existence, let alone her democratic freedoms..

      • carl jacobs

        This is what we call “Hasty Generalization.”

  • Jawahar Gandhi

    “They would be important concerns for any elected politician to be asked
    to address, let alone one who (it seems) is about to be elected Leader
    of HM Loyal Opposition.”

    Why would they be important concerns? Is Corbyn going to be elected to the Israeli Knesset or the British Parliament?

    Please stop your Hasbara and act like a true British Patriot, not someone subservient to an alien tiny country in the middle east UNLESS YOU HAVE BEEN INFECTED BY THE DISPENSATIONALISM MANIA PROPAGATED BY THE ZIONISTS.

    • Anton

      Not all Zionist Christians are dispensationalists. Dispensationalism is an American thing. Modern Christian Zionism began specifically among the Puritans of England several centuries ago and then flowed into the wider British evangelical movement long before dispensationalism.

      • carl jacobs

        Dispensationalism is an American thing.

        Darby was English, thank you very much.

        [mutter muter]

        We Americans get blamed for everything.

        • Anton

          Don’t worry, the Romans got blamed for everything 2000 years ago too. I for one am grateful for the US nuclear umbrella under which I grew up and without which Western Europe would have been invaded by the Soviet Union, as its own files now document.

          As for dispensationalism: born in Britain but took off in the USA.

    • Pubcrawler

      Ooooh, cliche bingo anyone?

    • dannybhoy

      This is Christian blog Jawahar, where mainly Christians of all denominations and none share their thoughts and opinions on things theological, political and social.
      We’re not extremists, we don’t want to lynch anyone, and we’re usually very polite to each other. We tend not to belittle people either, and correct misunderstandings with grace and goodwill.
      Nice, ain’t it?

  • Jawahar Gandhi

    “If Jewishness is a problem for Jeremy Corbyn, and the existence of
    Israel a cause of offence, what response can he credibly make to those
    who are driven from their synagogues, spat on in the streets, harassed
    outside the school gates or kidnapped and murdered in their sleep,
    simply for wearing a kippa? What can he say to the relatives of those
    whose gravestones are desecrated with faeces or defaced by Nazi
    swastikas? How can the leader of HM Loyal Opposition speak peace to
    Jewish leaders while engendering polemics and hostility toward them,
    their religion, their heritage and their ancestors?”

    Well he can have the same response as other Christians have for the jews:

    http://www.haaretz.com/news/israel/senior-catholic-cleric-if-jews-want-respect-they-must-respect-others-1.463320

    http://www.timesofisrael.com/catholic-church-files-complaint-against-extreme-right-group-leader/

  • Matthew Gough

    Same things were said about Red Ken Livingstone-anti-semitic, IRA lover, Communist regime sympathiser and yet he was an effective mayor by any fair standards. In terms of practical poltical leadership, what differences have such sentiments made?

    • CliveM

      Mayor of London isn’t leader of the country, doesn’t set domestic or foreign policy, doesn’t decide who we have relations with.

      • Anton

        And did deliberately decide to worsen congestion via unfriendly traffic light timings.

        • CliveM

          Well yes, I suppose he only said effective. It depends what you wish to effect.

  • len

    To subscribe to the abhorrent concept of anti Semitism must cast severe doubts on the judgement and the moral values of anyone who thinks fairness, equality, the right to defend itself and democracy, (the only one in the middle east) are ‘a bad idea’.

    I wonder exactly what Jeremy has in line for anyone who elects him as leader or the Country as a whole if he ever gets elected?

  • Slack Alice

    The big question is why none of the other labour candidates have raised this as a primary issue. They seem more concerned with Corbyn’s economic policies than his world-view.

  • Jawahar Gandhi

    I dont know since when has a leaders views ón Israel/Jews/Zonists become
    the criteria for a leaders ability to run his country, UK in this
    example’, rather than his economic prowess. I see the same thing
    happening more and more in America, where President Obama has to spend
    more of his time and energy satisfying the whims of the Israelis rather
    than focusing on the every day problems of the common people, the US
    citizens. Who is pulling these strings to control the political leaders
    of the West. Is this the future of the West? Very scary indeed.

    • Inspector General

      Just out of curiosity, what fate do you think lies in store for the inhabitants of Israel should the country fall?

      • dannybhoy

        Does it matter Inspector?
        It’s the plight of the common people he and Barack are most concerned about… :0)

        • Inspector General

          Well, it was rhetorical Danny. These fellows who are out to solve the world’s problems, like the so called problem of the existence of Israel, would rather not be drawn into speculating about the aftermath resulting from their wonderful plans. Not their concern, apparently…

          “What will be, will be”

          • dannybhoy

            Anti Jewish bias expresses itself in many forms Inspector.

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            If it is all right to have anti muslim bias, anti christian bias, whats wrong with anti-jewish bias realising that jews are not a race but a religious community.

          • dannybhoy

            For a Christian it’s one thing to have an opinion on an issue or about a person or persons; but having a bias is something we try not to have.
            Christians believe that we are called to love God with all our heart, mind and strength, and our neighbour as we love ourself.
            The way it works is that the more we know of Christ Jesus, the more we worship and read about Him, the more we see our own failings and selfishness. The more we see ourselves as we really are, the less quick we are to judge others.
            The other part of it Jawahar, is that Christians have ‘dual nationality.’ We are citizens of the kingdom of God on earth and citizens of our country, wherever we happen to be born.
            We obey the laws of our land as long as they do not ask us to do something which goes against our faith. We will fight for our nation as long as the cause is a just one, and we have a responsibility to make our views known when our government want to take us into unjust wars, or to change the meaning of marriage for example.

          • bluedog

            Good question, Dannybhoy, been wondering what motivates Mr Ghandi myself.

            The first name of the late Indian PM Nehru was Jawarhalal and he was christened Joe when at Harrow to keep it simple. Joe’s daughter Indira married a Mr Ghandi before becoming PM of India herself. It seems our own Mr Ghandi is using a shortened version of Jawaharlal for reasons that are currently obscure but possibly Hindu in motivation. It is hard to avoid the conclusion that our Mr Ghandi is anti-Semitic, anti-Christian and anti-Western. This is consistent with a certain strand of Hindu nationalism about which one reads.

          • Inspector General

            The fellow’s a muslim, blue. Didn’t you twig? Probably Pakistani, and it seems, interested in mammon as Dominic has determined above…

          • bluedog

            Well he’s certainly very defensive of the murderously barbaric creed of Islam. But the Hindus burn churches too.

          • Inspector General

            An anti Jewish Hindu? Can there be such a thing?

          • bluedog

            Very much so. Google the term Parsee, the name for the followers of Zoroaster who fled to India to escape the Muslim conquest of Persia aeons ago. Because Zoroastrianism is monotheistic the Parsees are regarded as being followers of an Indian form of Judaism. The Parsees were very influential in Karachi and Bombay during the Raj and continue to be highly successful and therefore envied. The Tata Group that currently owns Jaguar/Land Rover is of Parsee origin. Freddie Mercury of the pop group Queen was a Parsee.

    • dannybhoy

      “..satisfying the whims of the Israelis rather than focusing on the every day problems of the common people, the US citizens.”

      I imagine those “common US citizens” will be quite touched by your concern
      Jawahar..

    • carl jacobs

      Don’t know much about American politics, I see.

  • Jawahar Gandhi

    Why is somebody criticising Israel/Zionists/Jews called an anti-semite by the Jews? The underlying pretext is that Jews is a Semitic race as such criticising Jews is tantamount to criticizing a race, i.e. racism.

    But in fact Jews are a religious community, followers of Judaism, just like Christians and Muslims are religious communities, followers of Christianity and Islam.

    Race is a biological thing, passing from one generation to the other through genes. Majority of Jews are not Sephardic, rather they are Ashkenazi, Kazars, etc
    from the Central Asian/Eatern European region. The only thing tying them together is Judaism, a religion. If Jews is a race, not a religious community, then I have yet to hear about a Jewish Muslim or Jewish Christian after he adopts Islam or Christianity as his religion similar to an Arab Muslin or an Arab Christian which proves ‘Arab’ is a race, but not Jew. Also, if a person who is a non-Jew, when he adopts Judaism as his religion, he becomes a Jew. Ivanka Trump, the daughter of US Presidential aspirant Donald Trump converted from Christianity to Judaism and now she is hailed as a Jew.

    This myth of Jews being a race was invented by the Zionists, but why? So that the Zionists/Jews could have a free hand to criticise Muslims/Islam and Christians/Christianity under the garb of freedom of speech but if someone does the same against Jews/Judaism or even Israel/Zionists, they could easily try to shut him up by wielding the card of racism, in their false analogy Anti-semitism. This is a very shrewd and cunning strategy adopted by the Zionists.

    The Jewish sources themselves have rejected to call Jews as a race but as
    a religious community. So why this claim of Anti-semitism, racism? If we need to protect the religious community of Jews and Judaism, then instead of enacting Anti-semitism laws, we need to enact Anti-bigotry laws, but then those laws would not only protect Jews/Judaism but also Muslims/Islam and Christians/Christianity. But this would be not palatable to the Zionists/Jews as they would lose their immunity to criticise Muslims/Islam and Christians/Christianity.

    Please see below for my references:

    http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Judaism/jewnation.html

    http://www.jewfaq.org/judaism.htm

    http://www.rafapal.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/Shlomo-Sand-The-Invention-of-the-Jewish-People-2009.pdf

    http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/opinion/you-can-t-be-a-jewish-muslim-1.309646

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Who_is_a_Jew%3F

    • Inspector General

      The Inspector has posed you a question. Care to answer it?

      Further down, you mention ‘causation terrorism’ and ‘reactionary terrorism’. Somethings missing, can you guess what it is? Of course you can, for you are a bright fellow. Why, it’s Islam, is it not? Or to give it its generic name, ‘religious terrorism’….

      • Jawahar Gandhi

        There is no religious terrorism or Islam involved here, that is pure Islamophobic Hasbara disseminated by the Ministry of Public Diplomacy (Hasbara) headquartered in Tel Aviv. What is involved here are the victims of oppression of occupied lands who by chance happen to be muslims. Dont forget that the Christians in Palestine are subject to the same atrocities by the Israelis. George Habash, the leader of the most violent Palestinian group was a Christian.

        • Inspector General

          Inspector General Jawahar Gandhi • 3 hours ago

          Just out of curiosity, what fate do you think lies in store for the inhabitants of Israel should the country fall?

    • Anton

      “If Jews is a race, not a religious community, then I have yet to hear about a Jewish Muslim or Jewish Christian after he adopts Islam or Christianity”

      There may in principle be Jewish Muslims although there are unlikely to be many given what the Quran has to say about Jews. But in the Holy Land today there is a flourishing community of Jewish believers in Jesus who accept the New Testament in its entirety. Many call themselves Messianic Jews (Messiah [Hebrew] = Christ [Greek].) They are not high-profile but neither do they have to keep hidden as do Christians and Jews in most of the rest of the Middle East.

      • Jawahar Gandhi

        But the state of Israel does not accept them as jews, whatever they want to call themselves. The important thing is the Official Status, not what a group call themselves, Messianic Jews or otherwise

        • carl jacobs

          Where do you live, Jawahar Gandhi, and why do you have such a burr under your saddle for the Jews?

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            Does not matter where I live, important thing is what I say. I have no hatred for jews, I like them like I like people of all faiths, but I hate their policy of hate mongering and bigotry against non-jews using their Anti-semitism card.

          • carl jacobs

            Does not matter where I live

            Well, I have fairly well determined that you aren’t living in the US. And you aren’t a native English speaker. So it does make me wonder. Nicks mean nothing, after all. And there are many places in the world where nationality would directly affect this conversation. Anyways, it seems to matter among Jews – in your mind at least. Since virtually every argument you have made on this thread treats Jews as an undifferentiated mass. It’s only fair your state your own nationality so we can treat you after the same manner.

            I hate their policy of hate mongering and bigotry against non-jews using their Anti-semitism card.

            I see. Who are the “they” who implement “their policy?” I really expect an answer besides “the Jews.”

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            ‘They’ are the Zionist jews

          • carl jacobs

            Ah. So it’s only “Zionist Jews” who have a policy of “hate mongering and bigotry against non-jews using their Anti-semitism card.” Other Jews are all right then? They can make accusations of anti-Semitism and you would accept it. So this is all about Israel, it would seem?

            Where do you live again?

        • Anton

          If they were born there it accepts them as citizens, and unlike Arab citizens they are liable for National Service. That’ll do.

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            The topic is not about citizenship, it is about the false claim of jews being a race and the abuse of the Antisemitic card

          • Anton

            Re the antisemitic card, I take pains to distinguish between people who are anti-semites and people who are against the State of Israel. I have not got into where you stand and I don’t intend to. Re whether Jews are a race, you had better define race in general before trying to apply the notion to people who self-identify as Jews. It’s not so easy. What there is, is continuity of culture over 2000 years in a subgroup that has consistently married within itself. Of course there has been rape, to such an extent that rabbis declared Judaism would pass down the female line; and there have been gentile brides. So tests of mitochondria (the female line) or the Y-chromosome (the male line) aren’t going to show much. Nevertheless it can be said that people who self-identify as Jews will generally have a large proportion of genes from predecessors who did the same, all the way back to ancient Israel. Which is more/longer than can be said for most people who self-identify as French, English, etc.

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            First of all what is anti semitism, who are semites? Arabs are semites because they are a race, jews are not, they are a religious community like Hindus for example.

          • Anton

            OK we need to define anti-semitism, because most people take it to mean anti-self-identified-Jew yet the literal meaning is against the descendants of Shem, and that does include Arabs (even though many Arabs dislike Jews!) In what way are you using the term?

            As for Arabs being a race, please define race. you’ll find it’s like trying to nail jelly to the wall and I’ll bet that any definition you attempt would apply analogously to “the Jews”.

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            The Jewish Race or Jewish Nation is a myth invented by the Zionists. Redirecting you again to the Jewish source…..

            http://www.rafapal.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/Shlomo-Sand-The-Invention-of-the-Jewish-People-2009.pdf

          • Anton

            Define first what you mean by any race, then let’s see whether it can be applied to self-identified Jews…

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            Race is inheritance biologically, through genes, of generations upon generations, carrying same peculiar physical characteristics.

          • Anton

            Then essentially nobody is Arab or Jewish or English or Welsh or Scottish or French or German or Italian or…

            But do take note that the community of self-identified Jews has some specific genetically correlated diseases.

          • Martin

            JG

            Hence Jews are a race, descended from the tribes of Judah and Benjamin of the descendants of Israel.

      • carl jacobs

        Even so, the definition of “Jew” is highly unsettled given that a Jew can be both born and made. Jews can’t agree among themselves on how Jewish identity should be defined. However, there is broad agreement on this proposition – a Jew is not a Christian. A Messianic Jew is not considered a Jew by the Jews themselves. (Just ask Avi.) There is however no rational reason for this differentiation because the differentiation is irrational and sourced in history.

        The proper Christian response to this is “So what?” There is no longer Jew nor Greek. But on a personal level it can lead to much pain and heartache because of familial rejection. Part of counting the cost.

        • Anton

          Why should I ask Avi? I’ll take the word of the people themselves.

          • carl jacobs

            And what people would that be? Do you seriously reject the assertion that Jews do not accept the concept of a Christian Jew?

          • Anton

            I’m having this same discussion with Jawahar Gandhi immediately below. Please see my comments there!

        • Jawahar Gandhi

          You are deviating from the main topic: Why do jews falsely claim to be a race and abuse the Anti-semitism card?

          • carl jacobs

            If Judaism is only a religious community, then why are there secular atheist Jews?

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            You may have secular jews, athiest jews but not Christian jews or Muslim jews because Christianity and Islam are religions, secularism and atheism are not, just like you can have secular Christians, Muslims, etc etc

          • carl jacobs

            You asked …

            Why do jews falsely claim to be a race

            You said elsewhere on the thread …

            But in fact Jews are a religious community

            If one leaves a religion he leaves the community of that religion. There are no secular Muslims or secular Christians. Atheists do not say “I am an atheist Christian.” And yet there are numerous examples of Jews saying “I am an atheist Jew.” So what is the religious community to which the atheist Jew belongs?

        • Martin

          Carl

          Of course a Messianic Jew is a Jew, as were the first Christians. That Jews who are wedded to their traditions may not like it but that is merely prejudice against their own Messiah.

  • Inspector General

    Jawahar Gandhi, another question of behalf of us all. Why do you personally need to involve yourself in the doings in that part of the Middle East. One suspects you are of the sub continent, and thus removed. Surely there are more pressing immediates in your racial homeland that can utilise your valuable wisdom…

    • Jawahar Gandhi

      I repeat, it does not mattter what my origin is, where I live, whats my native tongue etc. What matters is my concern for people on humanitarian grounds, which I share with Jeremy Corbyn because he is a real humanitarian aspiring to govern UK in an ‘all inclusive manner’. Currently I feel that atrocities have been committed against Palestinians and bigotry and hate mongering in the form of Islamophobia against muslims, all inspired, managed and funded by the Zionist jews and as a humanitarian that is of importance to me, whether I belong to that community or not is irrelevant.

      https://cdn.americanprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/issues/2011/08/pdf/islamophobia.pdf

      • carl jacobs

        I repeat, it does not matter what my origin is

        If it does not matter, then why won’t you reveal it? Are you concerned that you would be treated the same way you treat the Jews? I wonder what I should infer from that.

        • Jawahar Gandhi

          I dont reveal it because it does not matter and so futile, because in my view, my or your origin and other details do not impact on the reality of the situation. However hard you try, you will not succeed to distract me from the main context.

          • Inspector General

            Not so sure on that. For example, if we have an ethnic based in England, looking to undermine the British way of life and values for his own personal and Islamic ends , we really ought to know about him…

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            I dont have to necessarily agree with you on this just as you dont have to agree with me in all what I have said here.

          • carl jacobs

            And if you were a Palestinian? Should I take that into account?

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            You may think whatever you want, does not concern me.

      • Inspector General

        Ah, well. We all want Jeremy to triumph. Goes without saying….

        • Jawahar Gandhi

          If you really do, then like me take up this nasty issue of antisemitism being raised against Corbyn so we can put this Hasbara to bed.

        • dannybhoy

          Lol!

      • Politically__Incorrect

        “he is a real humanitarian”

        Yet he willingly associates with those dehumanise, oppress, torture and kill others. Corbyn’s suppoerters are being being duped by his illusory ideas of “social justice” in the same way Lenin deceived the proletariat with ideas of “equality” and “fariness”. this is the great socialist con. Most of us can tell by the company he keeps that this man has little interest in humanity. Apparently you are not able to see this obvious fact.

        • Jawahar Gandhi

          What you are saying here is zionist inspired Hasbara spread through zionist controlled mainstream media. I dont blame you to get brainwashed like many other commoners do.

  • carl jacobs

    So as best I can tell, Jawahar Gandhi’s argument goes like this:

    There is this religious community called Judaism. Some ex-members of this community (no longer religious Jews but somehow still Jews none the less) created Zionism on the false pretense that Judaism represents a separate people. Jews in fact are a sub-group within existing peoples. There are Jewish Americans. There aren’t any American Jews. Anti-Semitism is an invented assertion based upon the false premise that Jews are a separate people. Since Jews don’t constitute a separate people (but only a religion), there can’t by definition exist prejudice against anything but the Jewish religion. This false claim of racial prejudice is used to silence opposition to the Zionist ambition to create an illegitimate state of “Jews” in the Middle East. It’s all stage-manged by a vast cabal of Zionist conspirators who manage to make the President of the US jump to serve every Israeli whim. Insert appropriate histrionics about the oppression of the Palestinians, etc, etc, etc.

    Meanwhile, regarding the Arab paradise of Syria just to the North … where there is real oppression … not a word of condemnation is to be heard.

    • Jawahar Gandhi

      We ofcourse condemn this mayhem created in Syria. Syria was a peaceful country until its turn for destruction came according to the Zionist plan.

      Destruction of middle east is part of a long running plan of the zionists. Their plan is to destroy, through the religious extremists in America, all
      the surrounding middle eastern countries who dare to raise their
      voice against Israel. It was Afghanistan/Iraq, Lebanon, then Sudan,
      then Libya, currently Syria and Iran next target. It is no simple
      co-incidence that only those countries are being singled out as the
      first priorities who are vociferous in denouncing the zionist
      atrocities. Why Iraq first: Just go and revisit TV clips one day
      prior to the first attack on Iraq by Bush junior and you will see all
      the western media denouncing Iraq for what? Oppression of shia?
      Oppression of political adversaries? Oppression of rebels? No, none
      of those but for offering $25,000 to every Palestinian martyr killed
      by the zionists.

      We never heard of Shia-Sunni conflict until after Saddam Hussein’s Iraq
      was invaded under a false pretext. All the pundits warned the
      invaders (west) that removal of Saddam would lead to Shia-Sunni
      conflict leading not only to the killings of many innocents but also
      destabilisation and later breakup of Iraq and yet the invaders still
      persisted and bombed and devastated Iraq under the pretext of removal
      of Saddam Hussein. The same thing was forecasted about Syria and yet
      the west instigated and supported an illegal war by providing arms to
      the Sunni rebels. Dont you think it sounds a bit hypocritical to
      blame Islam for the infighting in middle east when any naive person
      can easily detect the intention of the Christian West (reconfirm US
      christian fundamentalism in Wikipedia) to systematically destroy the
      middle east, one country after the other under the pretext of
      bringing democracy, removal of tyrant regimes, etc and using
      strategies of making Muslims fight against each other (like
      Shia-Sunni)?

      This plan to annihilate the adversaries of the zionists continues unabated
      with the help of the US/NATO axis of religious christian
      fundamentalists whose core belief is no one would have salvation in
      the hereafter if he does not love Israelis more than himself as per
      the brainwashing done by the zionists through the manipulation of the
      christian bible.

      The biggest success of the zionist plan is the evolution of self-hating
      Muslims, who are misled to believe that the infighting between the
      Muslims in the middle eastern/muslim countries is a fault of the
      haughty fanatical Muslims rather than the shrewd cunning policy of
      the zionists making the Muslims fight among each other like the
      British did in the Indian subcontinent with their divide and rule
      policy.

      • Anton

        The West is completely screwing it up, but I find cock-up much more plausible than conspiracy.

        • Jawahar Gandhi

          I am atleast happy to see that finally there will be a man, Corbyn, hopefully at the helm of the country and he will expose this rightwing zio-religio fascists, the Tories and their disciples in the New Labour like Tony Blair for what they have wreaked havoc in the middle east inspired by zionist manipulated ‘Dispensationalist’ fanatical religious beliefs.

          • carl jacobs

            inspired by zionist manipulated ‘Dispensationalist’ fanatical religious beliefs.

            Statements like this lead me to believe that you don’t live in the West at all. You don’t have a clue about Western politics if you believe this is true. Especially about Europe. There is virtually no significant Christianity remaining in Europe, let alone Dispensationalism. Christianity doesn’t have the power or the influence to cause the “US/NATO” to “wreak havoc” in the Middle East. It’s doubly ironic since the “conspiratorial Jews” are thinking of leaving France because they don’t feel safe. The rising Muslim population is making its weight felt, and Europe is by and large too gutless to face it.

            Where did you learn this stuff?

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            I learnt it here,but first my take on it…….

            Now the question is how did the Zionists establish their influence in the West: mainly through extremist evangelical Christian organisations. The single largest block of people voting in Americain political elections is a religious group: The SB (Southern Baptists with 50 million plus voters) who have been quite successful in persuading the other non-SB protestant evangelicals to vote enmasse in harmony with them. Their main voting strategy: Support for
            Israel. What has led them to adopt this strategy? The Zionists of Israel. After the establishment of Israel, the Zionists were looking for a very strong base of support in the most powerful voting block in the most powerful country (economically & militarily) in the whole world: They found the most suitable candidate in the Southern
            Baptists of USA. To achieve their purpose, the Zionists adopted a 3-pronged strategy: 1) Manipulating the beliefs of SB adherents in a pro-Israeli fashion 2) Financial backing of political candidates who promise to support Israel – currently mostly the Republicans but also some Democrats 3) Hasbara: a campaign of propaganda of
            projecting high moral standards of Israel with simultaneous
            demonization of their adversaries like arabs and Muslims. I am going to concentrate here on the first strategy i.e. manipulation ofbeliefs of SB christians as this is the least talked about but in fact the biggest factor in creating support for the NC. The Zionists, after doing a thorough research of the christian scriptures found two outstanding opportunities of manipulation: (A) Expounding the theory
            of ‘Rapture’ or ‘Dispensationalism’ with the belief that the end times, a.k.a. Ärmageddon will not happen until the state of Israel is established completely i.e. the larger Eretz Yisrael. (B) No christian shall have salvation in the hereafter until he loves Israelis/jews more than he loves himself/herself. Inorder to inculcate these beliefs, the Zionists hijacked and manipulated the ‘Scofield Reference Bible’, a version of bible followed by most of the SB christians. When the Oxford University, the publisher of the
            Scofield Reference Bible ran short of funds for the publication of the Bible, it was funded by jewish Zionists Jacob Schiff, a Rothschild agent with the condition that the bible be amended for more explanation in the context of dispensationalism. Once this was agreed, there were extensive footnotes added to the bible, mainly
            supporting the creation of the state of Israel and the obligation to love jews and Israel, all of this was directed by Samuel Untermeyer, president of American Jewish Committee. This probably is the biggest coup pulled of by the Zionists to acquire the support of the christian masses for the support of the state of Israel and Zionists
            and in the process creating a new cult of Christian Zionism which did not exist a couple of centuries ago.

            Ok, here is where I learnt it….

            http://www.beliefnet.com/Faiths/Christianity/End-Times/On-The-Road-To-Armageddon.aspx

            http://rense.com/general60/zcre.htm

          • carl jacobs

            It’s a small thing, but revealing in its way. A vote total of 50 million is roughly what a Presidential candidate receives in a nationwide election. If there were 50 million SB voters who supported Israel because of dispensationalism, Obama wouldn’t be President.

            The actual membership of the Southern Baptist Convention is about 15 million. You really need to learn something about the US before you start pontificating about it.

          • dannybhoy

            Jahawar is very concerned about the “common people” rather than the Southern baptists..

          • bluedog

            Palestinian negotiator Zihad abu Zihad would be proud of you JG.

            You seem to have successfully absorbed his Dead Baby strategy. Every time the Israelis or a Western power deploy rational arguments about the rights of self-determination and right of self-defence of a State, the Palestinians produce pictures of Dead Babies. The more lucid and compelling the argument, the more pics of Dead Babies required to neutralise its effect. Of course, the truly gullible party is the Western Left, that falls for this deeply cynical Dead Baby ploy hook, line and sinker.

            Jeremy Corbyn and his ilk thrive on a daily diet of Dead Baby pics and the Palestinians are happy to oblige, by whatever means necessary. Leaves Hello! for um, dead.

          • Anton

            Well, we agree on the merits of Tony Blair.

      • carl jacobs

        Well, that was easy. Nice little rant there. And quite revealing. You forgot to mention that “9-11” was a Mossad plot.

      • The Explorer

        “We never heard of Shia-Sunni conflict until after Saddam Hussein’s Iraq was invaded.” I assume you mean S-S conflict within Iraq? Because there was the Iran-Iraq War of 1980-88. I grant you it was partly about power, but it was also religious insofar as it was caused by the fear that the Iranian Revolution would lead to the insurgency of Iraq’s Shia majority.

        Two points about that. The Shia were quiet, not because they were content, but because they were suppressed; and this war of Shia-Sunni conflict was well before the invasion of Iraq.

        • Jawahar Gandhi

          The Iran Iraq war was not a Shia Sunni war, it was a zionist inspired American supported and funded war for destruction of Iran. Pls read on……..

          http://www.globalresearch.ca/us-foreign-policy-and-the-iran-iraq-war/5253

          • The Explorer

            I’ve skim read it. I said religion wasn’t the only cause, but the fact remains that it wasn’t between, say, Theravada and Mahayana Buddhists. It was a conflict between Shia and Sunni Muslims, it lasted a long time, and I heard about it. I remember television images of a symbolic fountain of blood. And that was in Teheran: not Washington, not Tel Aviv.

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            Yes, but nevertheless according to the report in the link, it was an American/Israel inspired, supported and funded war, not Shia Sunni.

          • The Explorer

            Not my point. Put it this way. The causes of the First World War are disputed. What is not disputed is who took part.

            Interestingly, there’s a theory that the Gulf War of 1990 started because Iraq was in dire financial straits after the war with Iran. It needed high global oil prices. Hence its grievance against Kuwait for depressing the price of oil by over supply. Obviously, that must be wrong if the Iraq war effort was funded by America and Israel.

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            You drifting from Iran Iraq war to Gulf War. First come back to Iran Iraq war and lets finish it before we proceed further

          • The Explorer

            Not drifting. Logical progression. If Iraq was funded by America and Israel during the war with Iran, it should have had no financial problems when the war with Iran ended, and hence no grievance against Kuwait.

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            What is your point in that?

          • The Explorer

            Well, if Iraq had financial problems after the war then maybe it was because it had had to fund its weaponry itself. In which case it wasn’t funded (or only partly funded) by America and Israel.

      • carl jacobs

        We ofcourse condemn

        Anyways, who is “we?” What Islamic community do you represent?

        • Jawahar Gandhi

          We means the humanitarians, we are not obsessed by religion but we certainly are concerned if a religious minority is being demonized on account of it practicing its faith, whatever it may be.

          Carl, I must say I marvel at your tactics of getting out something personal out of my so persistently. The only place where I read this was in the Manual of Hasbara. Say, are you a jewish zionist Hasbarat sitiing in Tel Aviv, because hasbarats are famous for trolling over all the discussion forums, a big team scouring every single forum?

          • carl jacobs

            Uh-huh. “Humanitarians” as opposed Jews Zionist Jews who are responsible for every bad thing that has happened in the Middle East since 1948 Why is the Muslim world identical to the Third world? The Jews did it. Why are Muslim lands paragons of despotism and oppression and killing? The Jews did it. Why are Arab lands full of poverty and ignorance and desperation? The Jews did it. This all has nothing to do with Islam. It was that Crusader state plunged like a dagger into the heart of Islam. The problems of the Islamic world have been imposed upon it from the outside by Jews, and their ignorant Fundamentalist American lackeys.

            A very “humanitarian” argument if I do say so.

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            Carl, see my post below about the zionist plan for the destruction of middle east that answers your questions.

          • carl jacobs

            I was paraphrasing that argument. It represents a classic Islamist redirection of responsibility for Islamic failure onto an external agency. And it has just as much historical credibility as Hitler’s claim that World War II was a defensive war against “world wide Jewry.”

          • carl jacobs

            1. I don’t know what “Hasbara” means, and I haven’t felt motivated to Google it.

            2. I am an American, as can be observed from the fact that I know something of American politics.

            3. I am a Christian with utterly no belief in dispensationalism, and no recognition of the current state of Israel as the fulfillment of prophesy.

            4. I don’t like it when people try to hide national self-interest and race-hatred and envy and jealously behind pretty-fied phrases and arguments.

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            Aha, you drifting from Europe to America? A while ago you sounded like an European. Now if you are American and think that religion does not play a part in the West, look at this….

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_the_United_States

          • carl jacobs

            Jawahar

            I have voted in every American election (and a few by-elections) since Ronald Reagan was first elected in 1980. If you want me to talk about Religion in American politics, I can do that. I know very well its influence. I have been a delegate to a county, district, and state convention in an American Presidential election year. I have even sat on a few county platform committees. (A disagreeable and not-to-be repeated experience.)

            I know the state of religion in the US because I live here. You obviously do not. You have vastly overstated its influence, and are blind to the rapid diminution of that influence over the past 10 years. You don’t even understand that religious conservatism emerged in the 70s as a reaction to cultural issues like abortion. It was not a Jewish plot. It was not primarily about Israel. In general, Jewish American voters fear the “religious right.” They tend to be secular and liberal. That’s a funny position for the conspirators to take regarding their own creation.

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            How can you assume that I cannot be a resident of America? Very preposterous assumption.

          • carl jacobs

            Because you know nothing about the US.

          • Dominic Stockford

            He’s a Yank, he has been for years as we can all testify.

          • carl jacobs

            You can tell I am an American by my natural American humility.

      • dannybhoy

        Now you’re getting silly!
        You’ve changed from your first role as a humanist seeking world peace and harmony, into a swivel eyed conspiracy theorist out to save other conspiracy nuts..

      • bluedog

        ‘The same thing was forecasted about Syria and yet
        the west instigated and supported an illegal war by providing arms to
        the Sunni rebels. ‘

        And the subtle hand of Saudi Arabia was nowhere to be seen? Even though the Saudis have persistently supported Sunni politicians in Syria and Lebanon? Where do you get these revisionist ideas?

    • dannybhoy

      (Supplementary..)
      I agree with what you’ve said and as I understand it the origins of Israel as a separate people start in the Old Testament, as a people in a covenant relationship with God, with a clearly stated religious and civic code of laws and obligations. They became a nation with the God ordained journey from Egypt into Canaan (not Palestine!) and settled as twelve tribes. The twelve tribes eventually became two kingdoms Judah and Israel. They eventually went into captivity and came back to their homeland as a kind of amalgamation of tribes, although still aware of themselves as a nation in a special relationship with God. Tribal distinctions subsequently weakened and they regarded themselves more as a nation.
      So the history of the Jews is one of being a people and a nation. A nation who according to the Scriptures were driven out of their homeland after the destruction of the Temple in 70AD.
      That they have returned to that land is nothing short of a miracle, regardless of the circumstances.
      So despite being dispossessed of their national homeland for approximately two thousand years they remain a distinctive people bound together by a common religion and history.
      I guess that’s why they accept that there are both religious, agnostic and even atheistic Jews…

      • carl jacobs

        That they have returned to the Land also has nothing to do with Scripture. OT Judaism ended 2000 years ago. Judaism today has nothing to do with that Covenant. There is no more temple. There will never again be a temple. There will never again be a Priesthood offering sacrifices for sin. It’s over and done with.

        • dannybhoy

          The Covenant is not over Carl.
          Romans 11 Rabbi Saul..
          “11 So I ask, did they (the Jews) stumble in order that they might fall? By no means! Rather through their trespass salvation has come to the Gentiles, so as to make Israel jealous. 12 Now if their trespass means riches for the world, and if their failure means riches for the Gentiles, how much more will their full inclusion[b] mean!
          >>
          “25 Lest you be wise in your own sight, I want you to understand this mystery, brothers:[d] a partial hardening has come upon Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.
          26 And in this way all Israel will be saved, as it is written,
          “The Deliverer will come from Zion,
          he will banish ungodliness from Jacob”;
          27 “and this will be my covenant with them when I take away their sins.”
          28 As regards the gospel, they are enemies of God for your sake. But as regards election, they are beloved for the sake of their forefathers.
          29 For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.

          We Christians are the wild branches grafted in. We owe our salvation to God who came as a Jew to His own (Covenant) Jewish people.

          It doesn’t mean all who are Jewish will be saved anymore than it means that all goyim will be saved. Only those who respond to God’s offer of forgiveness redemption and adoption.
          So shall all Israel be saved.

          • carl jacobs

            Not all Israel is Israel.

            The Abrahamic Covenant was fulfilled in Christ. It goes on forever. The Mosaic covenant is over and done with.

          • dannybhoy

            I just said that!
            But in the context of Jahawar’s rant, I am of the opinion that the Jews are as much a nation as they are a people or a community.

          • carl jacobs

            Yes the Jews are a nation and a people. That doesn’t mean that OT Judaism still has purpose. The temple was destroyed for a reason. The priesthood was destroyed for a reason. The covenant is now through Christ. There is now neither Jew nor Greek. Right? There is no separate dispensation for the Jews. There is one dispensation for all people.

          • dannybhoy

            No.
            Not right.
            God made a covenant with the Jewish people, and Rabbi Saul makes it clear that He has not abandoned them even though they rejected Yeshua haMeshiach.
            A partial hardening has come upon them..
            Did you read what Paul wrote?!

          • carl jacobs

            Yes. Along with essentially every other Christian who read it before (say) 1900. The Church has become Israel. The Mosaic covenant was a conditional covenant with rewards and penalties attached. The Israelites didn’t keep the covenant. The penalties attached. The Abrahamic covenant was an unconditional covenant and continues through the Church.

            The Jews are still the chosen people. But God no longer deals exclusively with man through the Jews. All people are united through Christ into the church – Jew or Gentile. The Jews of today do not know God. You cannot know the Father except you know the Son. Modern Judaism is not a valid monotheistic pre-cursor to Christianity. It is a separate false religion worshiping a separate false god with form but no substance.

          • dannybhoy

            “The Church has become Israel.”
            The Church has been grafted into (true) Israel, Carl!
            Verse 29, For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable..”

            So the Jewish people will still figure in God’s plans for this world, but not all will be saved.

            “The Jews are still the chosen people. But God no longer deals exclusively with man through the Jews.”

            Correct, because as Paul says,

            “25 Lest you be wise in your own sight, I want you to understand this mystery, brothers:[d] a partial hardening has come upon Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.”
            I don’t believe in predestination. Only in the sense that all those both Jew and Gentile who respond of their own free will are predestined to become sons and daughters of God through the salvation secured by our Lord Jesus Christ.

            So at the moment salvation is proclaimed through the Church, and God’s plan for the end times has the nation of Israel centre stage..

          • dannybhoy

            Carl,
            here’s an interesting link on the subject of “The Israel of God” Galatians 6:16.
            http://www.bible-researcher.com/gal6-16.html

  • Martin

    Jeremy Corby? Isn’t he the racist who hates Jews?

    • Jawahar Gandhi

      Its the other way round, the Zionists/Jews hate Jeremy Corbyn and Corbyn is not a racist because Jews are not a race

      • Dominic Stockford

        Oh yes they are.

      • Martin

        JG

        Of course the Jews are a race in the sense that they are descended from Israel’s son’s, Judah and Benjamin.

        And Jeremy Corbyn support terrorists who attack them. That seems like racism to me.

  • The Explorer

    Jawahar has certainly given this thread a new lease of life!

    • Jawahar Gandhi

      Thanks and I will keep on exploring with your help, exploring how to work for the betterment of humanity and riddance from bigotry.

      • Politically__Incorrect

        In seeking the betterment of humanity, do you condemn the actions of ISIL against civilians of whatever faith or ethnic group?

        • dannybhoy

          That’s an unfair question to address to an unbiased humanist who wants only peace and justice in the world….

          • Politically__Incorrect

            Well I’m glad he wants to get rid of bigotry: that’s the end of Islam and the Liberal Left, if nothing else.

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            If bigotry is rid of, it will be the end of Zionism. but again you have expressed your religious bigotry here commenting on Islam. If i were a bigot like you, I would have said end of Talmudic Judaism, but instead I said zionism.

          • Are you a fan of the Talmud, Jawahar?

        • Jawahar Gandhi

          I ofcourse condemn ISIL, but I condemn many times more the creators of ISIL. Where was ISIL these hundreds of years, never heard their name.

          OK, here is the million dollar question: Can Muslims sympathize with ISIS and their likes?

          Answer: No, impossible. How can a muslim sympathize with ISIS because the main victims of ISIS atrocities are Muslims, not non-Muslims. Only an insane muslim, not in the metaphorical but real meaning, can support ISIS.

          And BTW, where do u think ISIS is getting their modern weaponry to fight state armies and where do the funds come from to buy them? Dont give me that stale propaganda of being funded by extremist fanatical
          Muslims or Russia, as you can find in zionist propagated misinformation on the internet. Like I said no sane muslim would finance ISIS, the oppressor of Muslims. And BTW, if the western powers, like NATO want to eliminate ISIS, they can do so within a week. After all the western powers annihilated Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya in practically
          no time. So, dont be naive, use your logic and understand who is behind ISIS.

          • Politically__Incorrect

            I see you like to make a lot of excuses for ISIL. As an organisation they created themselves. They attack people who have done nothing to provoke or offend them. Their attacks are not reprisals but sheer bigotry. It is a very socialist idea to say everything is someone else’s fault and to take no responsibility for ones own actions. ISIL were not provoked into existence but group out of a religious ideology. Despite what you say, many Muslims do support ISIL. one reason is it’s literal interpretation of the Koran, but also because of their intolerance of other faiths and ethnic groups.

          • Jawahar Gandhi

            If ISIL is supported by muslims after what they are doing to the muslims, then the muslims must be insane. I have got hundreds of muslim friends and not one of them supports ISIL, matter of fact they are so enraged that if they get their hands on an ISIL guy, they may lynch him straight away at the nearest tree without any trial. So sorry, I disagree with you on this.

          • Benjamin Waterhouse

            Really? Lynched from the nearest tree? That’s hardly a Christian thing to do…. Wait… I see a flaw in this…

          • DanJ0

            At least some of the weaponry was abandoned by the Iraqi army, wasn’t it? Also, there is significant geopolitics in the region, specifically to topple Al Assad. The Sunni Islamic states such as Qatar and Saudi want that, and the Turks have a vested interest in that and the Kurds coming to grief.

          • Benjamin Waterhouse

            Aha so you do agree that Islam is a Zionist Plot. Thanks.

      • Sam

        Sam’s helpful guide to a definition of anti-Semitism:

        noun: antisemitism

        hostility to or prejudice against Jews.

      • Darter Noster

        Yes Jawahar, you keep up the good work.

        When you’ve worked out how the Jews caused the extinction of the dinosaurs, you’ll let us know won’t you?

  • Dominic Stockford

    Mr Ghandi, posting below, has two interests when commenting via disqus. Promoting anti-jewish thought (normally hidden behind the claim to be ‘anti-zionist’), and various financial matters (mostly demonstrating a need to know by asking questions about fairly basic financial market transaction processes). Indeed, he seems to want to know an awful lot about how to do dodgy deals…

    An odd mix.

  • Sam

    Dudes

    I’ve read enough of Jawahar Ghandi’s theories about Zionism and Judaism, below.

    (Jawahar: I’m just back from my Shabbat rest: you’ll be pleased to know that this Zionist has waxed his horns , brushed his tail and polished his hooves etc ).

    But noting your views that Judaism, Jews and Zionism are secretly in control of the world, could Zionists also be behind Islam and the Quran? Think about it: the ultimate conspiracy theory! Zionists creating a work of fiction to brainwash half the goy and get sympathy from the other half…..so we can secretly rule the world somehow?

    • bluedog

      A brilliant insight, Sam. There is little doubt that Mahommed was a Mossad double-agent.

      • carl jacobs

        So … the Knights Templar, and the Illuminatti .. they were all a Mossad plot stretching back to the .. the ROMANS! THE ROMAN EMPIRE WAS A MOSSAD PLOT! Is there no limit to their Jewish deviltry?

        And how come Avi hasn’t got me my money for supporting the World Wide International Jewish Conspiracy to Rule the World in (oh) say three years. I’m beginning to doubt his claims of bureaucratic delay.

        • bluedog

          It get’s worse, Carl. It’s been suggested that Dan Brown wrote the Koran on orders of Mahommed, and we both know who was behind Mo!

          Harrison Ford (he’s Jewish) will shortly be announced as playing Mahommed in the forthcoming movie ‘Koran’. And we know who finances Hollywood, don’t we?

          PS, Doesn’t HM Queen look like everyone’s favourite Jewish granny?

          • carl jacobs

            Well, technically the Jews finance everything so we don’t need to keep saying it.

            Except evidently for my monthly stipend to support the WWIJCtRtW! Which evidently doesn’t rank very high in the budget priorities! I’m talking to you, Avi!

          • avi barzel

            I’m sorry, what were you saying?

          • carl jacobs

            I was SAYING that my stipends checks are three years late. And since you guys are responsible for pretty much everything back to at least the Roman Empire, I find it HARD to credit your claims of bureaucratic mix ups.

          • avi barzel

            Um, see above, Carl. I’m looking at your file and we have you as an intern. That’s nothing to scoff at, you know. Look how far that girl Monica got. You’ve done dome good work, but you haven’t been on board with Pollard and that USS Liberty kerfaffle and some of the guys are not happy. But I’ll see what I can do getting you thise Denny’s coupons.

          • carl jacobs

            We’ve never talked about Pollard. Did you just infer that?

            You are correct about my opinion, of course.

          • Pollard? The English cricketer? Surely not?

          • carl jacobs

            Jonathan Pollard is a Jewish American who committed espionage against the US back in the 80s. He delivered some highly sensitive information to the Israelis. In the process he compromised a lot of stuff. The damage he inflicted on the US was so severe, he probably could have been executed. IIRC, the death penalty was taken off the table to get him to cooperate in mitigating the damage. You should watch then SecDef Cap Weinberger talk about the Pollard case if you can find video of it. Pollard was sentenced to life in prison and is currently serving that sentence.

            Because Pollard spied for the Israelis, there are people who say “Well, that isn’t really spying. The Israelis are allies.” There were people then, and people now, who believe he was treated unjustly. They thought he should be pardoned, or exiled, or something … as long as it got him out of prison. They will admit that Pollard was a spy. They will however assert that his motives were pure, and his cause just. It’s effectively a claim of exemption from the law for the sake of Israel and because he is Jewish. Which offends me. A lot. I had access to some pretty sensitive stuff at one time when I was on a missile crew. No one would be clamoring for my release if I had compromised it.

            I tend to side with Weinberger. He should have been shot.

          • Yes, Jack was being frivolous and he is aware of some of the detail. Being released in November this year, isn’t he? Not sure Jack agrees with execution however, he tends to agree with the rest of your sentiments. Espionage is a dirty, dirty business. His motives in his own mind may well have been pure but, as Jack is always saying, ends never justify means.

          • carl jacobs

            His motives weren’t pure. He got paid, and he shopped himself to others besides the Israelis. The “I was doing it for Israel” line is a whole lot more palatable than “I was doing it to stuff cocaine up my nose.” I expect the reaction of the gov’t was due to the fact that it thought he got people killed.

            Yes, he is being released in November. Which also irritates me. A lot.

          • CliveM

            “Look how far that girl Monica got”

            What exactly are you expecting from all this Avi?

          • Actually, it’s not too well known but Lucifer is Jewish. Don’t ask Jack how ‘they’ managed to get him into heaven before creation. It just shows the extent of ‘their’ influence.

          • avi barzel

            Hey, watch it! She’s my bubbie, Her Majesty is. Best chicken soup and gefilte fish in the world.

        • Carl, it goes back to the building of Solomon’s Temple. ‘They’ tried their hand at Babel and then changed tactics. ‘We’ all know that.

          • bluedog

            If you’ve been to the Coliseum in Rome you will of course learn that it was financed by loot from the sack of Jerusalem by the Romans in AD 70. Not a glorious achievement really.

          • carl jacobs

            THE TOWER OF BABEL WAS A MOSSAD PLOT!

            You know? Being a Mossad agent must be a pretty amazing experience.

          • So was the Deluge.

          • avi barzel

            Yes, that’ where the KGB term “wet job,” for a sanctioned assissination comes from.

          • Ah, a member of the “tip of the spear” has appeared. Welcome. As a well connected chap, could you have a word in the shell like of the appropriate person concerning the Premier League this season?

          • avi barzel

            I’m a responsible officer in charge of important operations, Jack. My integrity is unsullied and such common pursuits are far below my class and station.Um, we can talk later and somewhere else?

          • See you “in the gap” then.

        • avi barzel

          I think there is some kind of misunderstanding. Weren’t you signed up for internship? But wait, there is a certificate coming your way, and the department chipped in for an all you can eat breakfast at Denny’s for a family of four, one free coffee refill for mom and pops and a strawberry sundae for the lil’uns!

          • carl jacobs

            ….

            No, no, no, no, no. I’m a Deputy Chief Operator – salary USD 4500 per month. Times 36 for back pay.

      • dannybhoy

        A ‘plant’!

    • Darter Noster

      It’s all so obvious now! Jawahar’s revelations could help solve some of the greatest mysteries in human history, like how the hell Dana International won Eurovision!

      It must be nice to realise, having been convinced by Jawahar’s relentless, watertight logic, that you’re in charge of the world eh Sam? That’ll come in handy for Wimbledon tickets… :o)

      Might a humble goy like myself make two small requests of my Zionist overlords…? Since you lot run the world, could we have Jackie Mason for President and more Falafel? Ta :o)

      • …. and Man Utd winning the Premiership, FA Cup and Champions League 2015/16?

        • Pubcrawler

          Surely Sp*rs are the team for our Zionist overlords.

          • Darter Noster

            They’re responsible for Communism and Capitalism, so backing both City and United should be a doddle… :oD

          • City are owned by the Abu Dhabi United Group for Development and Investment. Can it be possible Zionist funding is behind this group too?

          • Too obvious.

          • Pubcrawler

            Gosh, they’re way too cunning for me.

            But if means Sp*rs will never win anything, I’m cool with that.

          • A League Cup and possibly the FA Cup will be arranged soon. Hence the sudden *unexpected* emergence of Kane. (The name was clever too).The Premiership? Not part of the plan just yet.

        • carl jacobs

          Not even the Mossad could pull that off.

          • Are you saying Alex Ferguson is more powerful than Mossad?!

          • carl jacobs

            Yes, we are talking about the present, Jack.

          • You don’t really believe Fergie is Scottish, do you?

          • carl jacobs

            I thought Fergie was part of the Royal Family.

          • Yes Carl, but Americans are not permitted to refer to Sarah, Duchess of York in such an informal manner. However, you may use it to address the female vocalist for the American group The Black Eyed Peas,

          • carl jacobs

            I watch a lot of British television, Jack. (Currently re-watching “Touch of Frost” btw.) And I have noticed one thing. If there is British nobility involved, they are usually either 1) the killer or 2) venal, corrupt, and criminally involved even if not the killer.

            I don’t perceive a great deal of love towards the British nobility in British culture, Jack.

          • There isn’t for nobility in general – just towards the Queen and a sort of romantic sentimentality felt for Princess Diana. Interesting how the British have resolved that tension too. It’s why Charles will never be loved should he ever become King. The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge have helped the Monarchy in this respect.

            Even so, we don’t permit those from rebellious ex-colonies to take liberties.

          • carl jacobs

            Well, Americans don’t stand much on ceremony and we don’t have much use for nobility so … Fergie seems appropriate to an American mind.

          • dannybhoy

            “Well, Americans don’t stand much on ceremony and we don’t have much use for nobility so..”

            Ged aht of it! You Yanks positively fawnnnn over our Royal Family! It’s embarrassing.

          • carl jacobs

            Being put on the cover of “People Magazine” is not being fawned over.

          • dannybhoy

            We know that most Americans just ‘luuurve’ British royalty, Carl.
            You’re in denial.

          • carl jacobs

            Perhaps we love them because they are over there.

            Anyways. Watching a real-life Royal version of Downton Abbey is not the same thing as love.

          • “Americans don’t stand much on ceremony …”
            Oh you’ve got your ceremonies and your ‘nobility’.

          • Darter Noster

            Moyles has to have been some-one’s fault…

          • carl jacobs

            So first you afflict me with a non-English word like “doddle” and now you abuse my poor American sensibilities with an ambiguous reference to “Moyles.”

            To whom do you refer?

          • You should see what the word means in Australia.
            Who or what was or is Moyes?

          • Darter Noster

            Oops! :o)

            Still, it’s hard to believe Chris Moyles isn’t an evil plot…

          • Darter Noster

            David Moyes – not Moyles; my bad – Man United’s previous, diabolical manager.

          • “So first you afflict me with a non-English word like “doddle” …”

            Tsk, tsk ….
            “Doddle”? What? Too lazy to consult an English dictionary, Carl?

            Where’s Linus?

          • carl jacobs

            No, I looked it up. I had to. I wasn’t sure if it was a good thing or a bad thing. But that isn’t the point.

          • Hmmm … because a word is unfamiliar in the American-English dialect you want to deny its authenticity in the language from which your hybrid tongue derived.

          • carl jacobs

            You see, there are prototypes and then there is production.

          • Hmmm …..
            You know you shamed Linus into deleting all his comments and closing his account? Poor chap to fall on his blogging sword like that. And all his Shi’te wisdom lost to posterity too.

          • carl jacobs

            No, I don’t think so. He departed in a fit of anger and superiority. That was his equivalent of slapping his sandals on the door frame.

          • Maybe … perhaps it was his Waterloo though.

          • carl jacobs

            Think about it. Assume you want to leave and you want everyone to know you have departed. How do you do that? How do you guarantee yourself the last word?

            You delete all your comments. That’s what he did.

          • Very passive-aggressive … but what drove him to desire to leave?

          • carl jacobs

            I suspect the thrill of all that acidic rhetoric finally wore off. He just got tired of it. That episode was the denouemont … as it were.

          • avi barzel

            Um, denouement. But don’t blow away your posts and disappear on account of that. You have so much more to blog for.

          • carl jacobs

            I assume you realize that we have license to deliberately misspell French words just to irritate the Imperial French Committee to Defend the French Language from the Encroachment of English Influence.

          • avi barzel

            I’m glad you take this so well. You do realize that what probably led to Linus’ departure was also the letter “e”. He insisted on “pissoire.”

          • carl jacobs

            Umm … It’s French. Why does anyone care? Think of all the important languages in the world – languages that would be useful to learn. Would French make the list? It’s spoken in France and Quebec and some African countries. People in Quebec speak English. The French should be made to learn English on general principles. And the Africans would do well to learn English to help them integrate into the global economy.

            As far as I can tell, the only reason to learn French is to read French literature without translation. The thought is enough to make one accept purgatory.

          • bluedog

            A conspiracy theorist would have marked Linus as being in one of two, or possibly both, agencies. He was either a journalist or an employee of a French government agency, such as ANSSI. The inevitable pattern in his posts showed a particular interest in British attitudes towards the EU. He was singularly unsuccessful in changing the deeply Euro-sceptic opinion found on this blog. His type are a familiar occurrence on other British blogs.

          • The Explorer

            If Linus’ self-declarations about all his properties were true, he probably owned the newspaper.

          • He was too out of control to be a member of any group.

            Perhaps, after his humiliation at the hands of Carl, he concluded he had given a little too much personal information out. Hence the deletions. Attended a Catholic boarding school in the South, run by “Brothers”, where there was a suicide. Specific information about his French residencies and their location. Recently ‘married’ in Paris. Not too difficult to identify him if one had a mind to.

            Jack did wonder if all this might be a prelude to him carrying out his threat to report the Inspector for inciting hatred. Nonsense, of course, but Linus’s pride was hurt by losing face so publically and pride is very important to him. By deleting his comments he can feign the comments have triggered hurt and fear in him. Should we start preparations for a “Defend the Inspector” campaign?

          • Pubcrawler

            He can ‘delete’ all he likes: the Internet never forgets, his comments will be cached somewhere.

          • avi barzel

            Yes, theWay Back engine and His Grace did say it’s all in his admin archives.

          • chiefofsinners

            It’s all in our deleted emails. We could re-publish the lot. Would make a great book.

          • The Explorer

            It would certainly be wise to bear the possible necessity in mind.

          • The Explorer

            When I was discussing heretics with Linus, I mentioned the execution of Marguerite Porete. He said the Place de Greve (where she was burned) is near where he lives. That would put him in the 4th arrondissement, which includes Le Marais, the gay district of Paris. Figures.

          • Yes … and he also revealed the location of a historical residence on a pilgrim route.

          • Sam

            Could Linus have been an agent (or at least a tea boy) of the DGSE- Direction générale de la sécurité extérieure ?

          • bluedog

            Possibly. He made two revealing disclosures, firstly that he was the site to brush-up his English, secondly that he had once been on tour with Pres. Chirac. The second boast requires very high accreditation or security clearance.

          • Pubcrawler

            So you think he might have been pulled by his handler?

          • dannybhoy

            Really?
            When did that happen and what -if anything, provoked it?

          • The Explorer

            It was provoked by the ‘Planned Parenthood’ extremist thread. LInus got into a dispute with Avi about the validity of the word ‘pissoir’. LInus was going great guns, in dispute with half a dozen people simultaneously (Avi, Happy Jack, the Inspector, Pubcrawler, Carl Jacobs, me), but that was his last thread. A day or two later, all comments were deleted, and we haven’t heard from him since.

          • Sam

            Dude

            Well pissoir is definitely French. I’ve got enough French speakers in the family to verify that .I say French speakers as my brother in law’s family were from Morocco and my better half’s grandmother was from Tunisia , former French colonies. Like English American or Quebecois, it’s different to the the “Queens English” French of metropolitan France. I think my family has a more informal type of French with influences from other languages, such as English , Ladino Arabic and Hebrew.

          • dannybhoy

            “and my better half’s grandmother was from Tunisia”

            Better half? I didn’t know you were married yet, I thought you were still in the engaged stage..

          • dannybhoy

            He may have felt overwhelmed by a bunch of heterosexuals ‘ganging up’ on him! Quite something to have deleted all his comments though, rather unusual I would have thought.
            Still he had a good run here and was largely treated with respect, thank goodness.
            Perhaps one day like Napoleon he will return from his place of exile..

          • avi barzel

            LInus got into a dispute with Avi about the validity of the word ‘pissoir’…

            Uh-uh, can’t blame this one on the Zionists; it’s the Calvinists’ fault this time!

            Carl looked up the word and proved Linus wrong. Slam-dunked him with a sentence after the blighter went off on a mid term essay-length rant. Quite elegant…even I cringed for Linus.

            And I’m thinking that if the guy was bullshitting us about being part French and about his castle in France, with the damn moat and stuff, he might have overreacted in his paranoia, thinking his identity’s been trashed…over a “pissoir” of all thing.

            Or, he is DGSE and his handlers think that his cover was blown in a sneaky Mossad-CIA action and he is in some basement getting debriefed by a pair of pissoir-offed agents, chain smoking Gauloises and bawling his eyes out for betraying Le République.

          • carl jacobs

            So … why exactly would a French Intelligence Agency bother inserting an operator onto a British weblog to pose as an angry atheist homosexual?

          • avi barzel

            Because it’s French Intelligence.

          • French intelligence” – the perfect oxymoron.

          • avi barzel

            I don’t thing Carl has has ever watched anything with Inspector Cluseau.

          • carl jacobs

            You are kidding, right?

          • carl jacobs

            That Steve Martin … thing … was an atrocity.

          • Pubcrawler

            I’d managed to wipe it from my mind. Till now. Thanks a bunch.

          • carl jacobs

            Sorry. It’s Avi’s fault.

          • avi barzel

            See? It’s slways the Jews!

          • carl jacobs

            Well, I would have said “Canadians.” Anyways. How could I call myself cultured if I hadn’t seen “A Shot in the Dark” or “The Pink Panther.”

          • Pubcrawler

            The only reason I saw it was because it was the in-flight movie on a trip to Nova Scotia, so I sort of blame the Canadians anyway

          • carl jacobs

            On one of my trips to Japan (12-13 hour flight) I once actually had to confront the sad reality that my best movie choice was “Mall Cop.” I made it about 20 minutes, so I feel your pain. I have this theory that movie companies fob off terrible movies onto airlines because they have a captive audience.

            I saw the … thing … in a movie theater. My wife wanted to see it, IIRC. She is sort of an incurable optimist. Some roles should just never be reprised.

          • avi barzel

            Of course, I forgot about the Western Culture in Four CDs package, the one with the easy monthly payment plan. The Pink Panther follows the nouveau roman movement, if I recall.

          • carl jacobs

            I’m sure there are lots of Canadian movies in that package. Oh, wait…

          • You refer to yourself as “cultured”?

          • carl jacobs

            Of course. I’m an American. It’s a requirement.

          • Yes, Jack is well aware of the depth and breath of American culture from the swarms of tourists he witnesses in Scotland and London.

          • carl jacobs

            Glad you agree. I would hate to think you were being deliberately ironic in service to typical British prejudices.

          • The British do not have prejudices – just sound judgement.

          • carl jacobs

            just sound judgement.

            You mean like not starting Stanley Matthews against the Americans in the World Cup in 1950?

            Bwahahahahahahaha!

          • As Jack said, “stitch up”. Pressure brought to bear. You know how it works.

          • carl jacobs

            Yeh. How many shots on goal did England have in the match?

            [Clank!]

            “And another shot hits the cross bar.”

          • The sizes were adjusted electronically during the match ….

          • carl jacobs

            slways

            Is that some kind of French Canadian spelling of ‘always’?

          • Pubcrawler

            The spirit of Clouseau lives on!

          • chiefofsinners

            Linus has deleted himself. I fear we have heard the last. I hope he has found salvation, but it might have been my threat to make a book out of his postings. They’ve all been deleted. Shame. They were just the sort of questions you want unbelievers to ask.

      • Sam

        Well dude,

        I voted for Dana international….

        Alas currently out unit is busy trying to see if we can we can get Bahar Soomekh installed as the president of Iran.

    • carl jacobs

      Hey Sam

      You might have noticed a link to a youtube video that Jawahar posted below of Orthodox Jews in Israel treating Christian tourists badly. The video seemed to me a “Let’s go film the crazy fundamentalists” moment but for the sake of the thread (and lest anyone be deceived), could you watch that video and tell us:

      1. Who are they?
      2. What are they doing?
      3. Why are they doing it?

      • Worth a read of this too:

        http://www.firstthings.com/web-exclusives/2015/08/burning-churches-in-Israel

        It’s a report on the arson attack on the Roman Catholic Church of the Multiplication of the Loaves and Fishes in Tabgha, Israel, by Jewish Fundamentalists.

        “… the attack ended up being less notable for the actual damage done than for the remarkable outpouring of Jewish support for Christians following the crime. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu declared freedom of religion “a cornerstone” of Israel’s values, and urged Israel’s Shin Bet security service to speed investigations. President Reuvin Rivlin declared he was “shocked and saddened” and that every effort to “bring those responsible to justice” would be made. Members of three prominent Jewish interfaith groups, along with Knesset Speaker Yuli Edelstein and sixteen Orthodox rabbis, even spearheaded a fundraising campaign for repairing the church …

        So as we mourn and pray for those at the affected church, let us mourn and pray still more for our Jewish neighbors. In the end, Christians can have little to fear from arson attacks—we have already been saved from the lake of eternal fire. Despite the damage at the Church of the Multiplication, the meal of His Eucharist remains, granting us eternal life and salvation with a foretaste of that marriage feast of the Lamb in His kingdom which shall have no end. Let us pray fervently and wholeheartedly that our Jewish neighbors soon join with us to partake in that foretaste – a meal and miracle far greater than that of the multiplication.”

        (Ps – 6 up and 55 to go)

      • Sam

        Dude

        Well it took at a while.

        Aside from thinking the group was haredi or ultra orthodox, noo can do : there’s sod all context as to what would make these haredi go off on one as the camera never swings towards what they are upset about (i.e. the camera’s own group).

        It isn’t as the video author claims (or at least the guy who put it on u tube, who is raving against world Jewry on his written introduction , underneath the video) the sight of Christians, because Christians don’t have specific religious clothing ,unless you are a cleric (vicar, monk, nun) so as we can’t see any of them in the video .

        Plus haredi are insular even with other Jews . They only tend to get upset if you went into their neighbourhoods wearing a bikini, shorts or hotpants or suggest they join the IDF. So if they were getting angry at Christians they’d have to be a reason. I wonder if the group have a sign saying something which would annoy a charedi?

        But anyways the video fails because at least 2 Jewish women were arguing with them and there were hundreds of others going around their business. The cop is also seemingly trying to move the Rabbi and his cohorts on.

      • dannybhoy

        They are complaining about the (Christian) tourist group coming over and trying to (they think) proselytise.

        One guy says ‘look out for the woman with water in her hand she will try to baptise you! Other comments “Get off (our land) Go back to Europa Germania etc.

        They are unhappy that they are being photographed -some religious groups believe you capture the soul)

        The smaller man with the homburg says he is a rabbi and “al titzalem auti! (don’t photograph me!” He starts off phoning someone and complaining that they have taken his photo..

        The Israeli woman is saying “Mah korah, mah korah?!” which means “What’s going on?!”

        Life can get very exciting in Israel!

        Here’s another clip along the same lines, although the American is a Christian, and thinks he can just come and ask questions about the conflict on the street.

        But the street happens to be in Jerusalem’s Mea She’arim area which is strictly religious.

        And Jerusalem has had/is having its share of terrorist attacks..
        https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=terror+attacks+in+jerusalem&biw=1366&bih=609&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0CCAQsARqFQoTCILhqq_xrccCFWGB2wod6DIFGg

        Frankly, apart from being disrespectful, he is being naive and provocative. Even Israelis tend not to mess with these guys.
        I think he would get a similar reaction if he went to Gaza..

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jG6kJm-50k

        The point is that these are people who feel very strongly about their faith, many of them will have had family who experienced persecution in Europe and lost family in the Holocaust.
        You simply don’t go into a community like that as a Christian, and ask people who have seen their own blown up in terror attacks about ‘living in peace as a two state nation..”

  • Jack’s sources inform him Jawahar Ghandi is, in fact, a Zionist agent under deep cover. It is his mission to discredit all opponents of Zionism by feigning stupidity, bigotry and ignorance.

    • Darter Noster

      They must have trained him VERY well!

    • Ivan M

      They’ve trained him well. He is better informed than most and has a doughty spirit. Perhaps he has slipped the CRIMESTOP leash?

    • Ivan M

      Boss, after mulling a remark in the comments on a Guardian article concerning the JFK assassination, I am beginning to feel that the ZOG conspiracy arranged the defeat of England in the 1970 Mexico World Cup. What possessed Sir Alfie to pull out Bobby Charlton in the German game? It has been downhill ever since.

      • carl jacobs

        conspiracy arranged the defeat of England in the 1970 Mexico World Cup.

        OK, now we have entered tin-foil hat territory. Why would anyone have to conspire to defeat England in the World Cup. Even the Americans have defeated England in the World Cup. OK, it was 1950. But still…

        • Ivan M

          But its all starting to make sense. Peter Bonetti instead of Gordan Banks in goal. And BTW, the back flip save that Banks seemingly executed against Pele is impossible. Some kind of camera trick. Banks had a bad back troubling him from his brick-laying days. And who benefited in the end?

          (Won’t be replying as I am headed out for a couple of days.)

        • Finney’s shot on 45 minutes would have hit the back of the USA net. Who do you think was behind the referee blowing the whistle just as he was about to shoot? And, it was a penalty in the 82nd minute and Mullen’s header did cross the line.

          • carl jacobs

            Umm … Jack? As we say in the US … “Scoreboard.”

          • “Stitch-up”, as we say in the UK.

          • carl jacobs

            So what happened to “Stiff upper lip” and all that? Your reaction doesn’t seem very British, Jack. It seems almost … French. You know. Emotional. Irrational. Bitter. Did I mention “bitter”?

            If it helps, you should take comfort in the fact the the US didn’t qualify for the World Cup for another four decades after beating England. Just desserts, I suppose.

            Wasn’t England the favorite in 1950?

          • It’s Jack’s Irish/Jewish temperament. And, as we Sons of Erin say: “Like the Murphys, I’m not bitter.”

          • carl jacobs

            So … Now you are saying that Ireland is like France? Should I start making reference to Monsieur Inspecteur General?

          • The Inspector does not have the soul of an Irishman. Call him what you want, with the exception of “Catholic”.

          • carl jacobs

            But the Inspector calls himself a Roman Catholic, and who am I to disagree? He is certainly as Catholic as all those Catholics on NCR.

          • Carl asks: “who am I (i.e. Carl) to disagree?”
            *gasp*
            *double gasp*
            *triple gasp*

          • carl jacobs

            Well, you know, Jack. The RCC is not so settled as it once was. It seems to be evolving in particular directions. Broadening out, as it were. So perhaps a non-Catholic such as myself shouldn’t try to apply dogmatic labels that might no longer be valid. According to the New and Improved RCC, the Inspector might be a perfectly fine Catholic.

            Who am I to say?

          • The Catholic Church has never really been “settled”. It has always had to contend with crises of one sort or another. Currently it is facing one of its more serious challenges and has been in the throws of a struggle for 50 years and more. The other fact is that the Catholic Church can never be “New and Improved”.

            All Jack can say is God help us all if the Catholic Church should finally succumb to modernism. If it did, it would no longer be the One True Church of Christ and, as Jesus promised, this just will not happen.

  • chiefofsinners

    Would just like to point out that Jawahar Ghandi is an anagram of ‘I had raw ganjah’, which might explain the extraordinary insight.

    • It’s also one for: “Ghana Jihad War”.

      “Gandhi’s Jawahar” is a derogatory term used by some traditional Hindus to refer to Mr. Jawahar Lal Nehru and the improper support he received from Ghandi in becoming Prime Minister.

      • Ivan M

        There were only two contenders for the Prime Minister’s post. Jawarhalal Nehru’s CV was better than that of Sardar Patel. The Hindus who cluster around the nostalgic neverland of Bharat Raj, gain a lot of traction by pretending that Patel would have launched India into the stratosphere.

    • dannybhoy

      (Aside: took him hours to work that one out…..)

  • Ivan M

    Comrade Corbyn credits some Jewish-led trade unions for his early interest in activism. His own parents either fought for, or sympathised with the Republican cause in Spain. He is one of the breed of socialists – they do exist; Chomsky for example – who regard Israel, as a late stage creation of Western imperialism to divide the oppressed of the world, here the Arabs. He does not come across as even a rhetorically mild antisemite, unlike say my hero Francisco Franco, the Catholic saviour.