ariana grande lyrics
Extremism

Do smutty and sexual Ariana Grande lyrics increase the risk of terrorism?

“My daughter saw things no child should ever have to see,” said the mother of young Ariana Grande fan earlier last month. She told of the emotional and mental impact on her child in the months following the Manchester Arena terror attack during Ariana Grande’s ‘Dangerous Woman’ tour. There they were on a girly day out, laughing, giggling, shopping, singing, and then Salman Abedi detonated his bomb killing 22 people, including young children. “Amelia has been really struggling since… talking in her sleep, she’s lost loads of weight, and she just wants to be isolated”.

“Amelia was panicking over sports day because of the starting gun – she’s now terrified of loud noises, and when a balloon popped at her dance show she went into hysterics. She has become quite clingy. Before she’d happily sit a few seats away from me on a train but now she wants to be near me in case something happens.”

There’s perhaps no easy time to talk about these traumas: the funerals may be over; the tributes sung; Manchester Arena reopened. But somebody somewhere is still grieving, mourning, or coming to terms with life-changing injuries. ‘We Are Manchester‘ might have made people feel a bit better, but it hasn’t made everybody safer.

“Protecting this country requires us to be both strong against terrorism and strong against the causes of terrorism,” Jeremy Corbyn said in a speech following the attack. He went on to focus on UK foreign policy and the failing ‘war on terror’ as a contributory factor to the Manchester bombing and other Islamist atrocities. “Those causes certainly cannot be reduced to foreign policy decisions alone,” he insisted, but it is clear from the rest of his speech that Corbyn believes that a change in foreign policy would mitigate, if not eradicate, Jihadism in the UK.

Let us set aside the naivety of this, and resist analysis of those countries (eg Sweden) and groups (eg Copts) who appear to be Islamist targets irrespective of foreign policy decisions (or, indeed, the power to articulate any foreign policy at all), and consider instead Corbyn’s exhortation to be “strong against the causes of terrorism”. He said:

Over the past fifteen years or so, a sub-culture of often suicidal violence has developed amongst a tiny minority of, mainly young, men, falsely drawing authority from Islamic beliefs and often nurtured in a prison system in urgent need of resources and reform. And no rationale based on the actions of any government can remotely excuse, or even adequately explain, outrages like this week’s massacre. But we must be brave enough to admit the war on terror is simply not working. We need a smarter way to reduce the threat from countries that nurture terrorists and generate terrorism.

Corbyn’s “smarter way” is basically for us to get out of Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria and other (majority) Muslim nations, and then to denounce Israel, laud Palestine and Palestinian terrorists, respect Islamist freedom fighters and honour “our friends from Hezbollah” and “our friends from Hamas“. If anything is pro-USA and capitalist, it is bad/wrong/evil, but if you’re poor and landless, there is no end to Corbyn’s solidarity, humanity and compassion. So, basically, if you mitigate the America-effect, respect Islam and nullify neo-liberalism, Utopia will descend in the clouds with red flags flying. Then the Islamists will stop bombing us. The task of government, he says, is to ensure “that our foreign policy reduces rather than increases the threat to this country”, and that is how you do it.

The thing is, the supremacist strain of Islam predates the 1948 restoration of Israel and all arguments over the pre-1967 borders, and will continue long after Palestine is declared an independent state and Israel wiped off the map. Islamic fundamentalist extremism and terrorism have their roots in Islamic orthodoxy: “The relationship between Muslims and non-Muslims, the relationship of Muslims with the state, and Muslims’ relationship to the prevailing legal system wherever they live … Within the classical tradition, the relationship between Muslims and non-Muslims is assumed to be one of segregation and enmity,” explains Yahya Cholil Staquf, a leading Islamic scholar in Indonesia. “To the extent that Muslims adhere to this view of Islam, it renders them incapable of living harmoniously and peacefully within the multi-cultural, multi-religious societies of the 21st century.”

The Wahhabi enmity towards the non-Muslim world is not simply focused on Western foreign policy, as Didsbury mosque, where the Manchester bomber once worshipped, helpfully illustrates: ‘Preachers at mosque where Manchester bomber prayed called for homosexuals, British soldiers and non-believers to be killed‘; ‘Question Time audience member reveals shock leaflet “given at Manchester killer’s mosque”‘:

“Living in a society in which people have accepted Western lifestyle as their way of life brings immorality at every step. Modesty, shame and honour have no place in Western civilisation.”

He continued: “That is direct from Didsbury Mosque and that was given in a very expensive package with DVDs.”

…“It’s a charity leaflet that’s given out officially from Didsbury Mosque.”

The mosque’s director of trustees Muhamed El-Khayat insisted the leaflet was not an official communication.

He said outsiders sometimes left leaflets inside which was a problem they were battling to stop.

Yes, of course: Didsbury mosque is a public place of worship and Hindus are very welcome to leave their puja promotional leaflets in the hope of making converts for Krishna, and no one at all in the mosque will check these for blasphemy or anything remotely haram.

But this leaflet is important, for it takes us to a root of Islamist enmity which the politicians and the media choose to ignore: Western decadence, immorality, sexualisation, perversion and moral degradation. The “Western lifestyle… brings immorality at every step,” they say. “Modesty, shame and honour have no place in Western civilisation.”

Which brings us back to Ariana Grande lyrics.

“My daughter saw things no child should ever have to see,” said the mother of this one young victim.

What about the things her daughter should never have heard?

Ariana Grande may have the appearance of a Disney princess, but her music and lyrics are positively pornographic:

Here’s ‘Side to Side‘:

I’m talkin’ to ya
See you standing over there with your body
Feeling like I wanna rock with your body
And we don’t gotta think ’bout nothin’ (’bout nothin’)
I’m comin’ at ya
Cause I know you got a bad reputation
Doesn’t matter, ’cause you give me temptation
And we don’t gotta think ’bout nothin’ (’bout nothin’)

…This the new style with the fresh type of flow
Wrist icicle, ride dick, bicycle
Come through yo, get you this type of blow
If you wanna Minaj, I got a tricycle

Reputation doesn’t matter; temptation is good. So what? Well…

“Wrist icicle” is when someone manually masturbates a man, he ejaculates, and the giver then has ejaculate dripping from their wrist.

“Ride dick bicycle”, fairly obvious, woman-on-top copulation.

“Blow”, oral sex.

“If you wanna MÉNAGE”, ménage a trois, fornication/sodomy with three people.

Here’s ‘Right There‘:

A player too, you know I have some girls missionary
My black book and numbers thicker than the dictionary and Bible
I got it recycled…

She wouldn’t sing that about the Qur’an, would she?

There is more – much more “brutal truth” – which respectable parents might not want their eight-year-old daughters to know about at all: what lies beneath Ariana Grande lyrics is really quite shocking. You’re free to do the research yourselves. WARNING: the content of that particular site is potent, if not downright offensive and sometimes gratuitously so, and yet strangely enough it articulates the very sorts of feelings about sexual immorality and moral depravity which the Didsbury mosque leaflet highlights, and which the Bible commends:

Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body‘ (1Cor 6:18).

Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry‘ (Col 3:5).

But among you, as is proper among the saints, there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality or impurity or greed‘ (Eph 5:3).

If the intolerant and supremacist strain of Islam seeks to eradicate the Ariana Grande sort of sex and smut from society in order to honour Allah, and the Islamist strategy for doing so is to kill the source by bombing what they consider orgies of abomination in order to deter youth from the ways of the world, the flesh, and the devil, why doesn’t Jeremy Corbyn want to be “strong” on this “cause of terrorism”? Why must UK foreign policy be changed, but our sex-obsessed culture not?

  • Manfarang

    No.
    Ariana Grande held a concert in Bangkok last month. There was no trouble.

    • bluedog

      ‘There was no trouble.’

      Meaning the goons of the Thai regime decided not to attack the audience?

  • Simon Platt

    I suppose the answer to the question “do smutty and sexual Ariana Grande lyrics increase the risk of terrorism?” is “yes”. But that’s not the reason they’re bad; they’re bad in and of themselves, and should be called out for that reason. Of course, its harder to do that since the atrocity at the Manchester concert. But we shouldn’t change our ways because of the threat of terrorism.

    • I believe this response is the morally correct and politically sensible one.

    • Anton

      Careful with the use of “we”, friend; it is easy to oscillate unintentionally between meaning the church and the world, and the world desperately needs to change and repent.

      • Simon Platt

        Perhaps I didn’t make myself clear. I do think we should change our ways in many respects, and I do mean society as a whole, and I do mean to include the obscenities identified by Cranmer and Barnhardt. But I mean to say that our motive ought not to be fear of attacks by Moslems (who, in any case, know and care little for chastity).

  • Anton

    “Do smutty and sexual Ariana Grande lyrics increase the risk of terrorism?”

    We may usefully distinguish between correlation and causality here. Ariana Grande’s filth does not cause terrorism. But Islam is rising in the West as impending judgement for certain sins, and Grande’s lyrics represent an overflow of those same sins. So the two are correlated even though one does not cause the other.

    Those sins? The ones behind family breakdown. Statistics for births outside marriage, divorce, children living with only one parent, and abortion have rocketed from a few percent, a number stable for centuries, to nearly 50% in one lifetime. Islam was not superior to pre-1960s Western culture but is superior to its successor.

  • Anton

    Some people say that Islam needs to undergo its own Reformation. It is doing exactly that, bang on schedule – a return to its sacred writings and the militancy therein.

  • Brendan McNeill

    I had the misfortune to watch an interview with two parents and their teenage daughter at the recent ‘memorial’ concert, or whatever vacuous name was given to it. The daughter was there displaying her bare midriff defining her as an infidel whore, while her parents mouthed platitudes about ‘being strong’ that must have been given to them by the BBC before the interview.

    No anger, no indignation, just mindless dhimmitude.

    If you want evidence that Britain is lost, that interview was all you need.

  • Jenny Taylor writes about the convergence of ‘raunch culture’ and Islam in an article published shortly after the Manchester attack. She agrees that Muslim supremacy ‘is fueled by their sense of Western degeneracy’ but makes the point that Islam is in Britain (and the West) ‘to triumph’. Even if raunch culture were outlawed, even if Western women and girls behaved and dressed in a manner pleasing to Islam, Muslims would still be at war with the West until, as Qur’an 2:190 has it, ‘Allah’s religion reigns supreme.’

    • DWMF

      You have somewhat answered my question: Who writes these pornographic lyrics? It’s the ‘raunch culture’ of the American pop music industry. Post facto Bowdlerisation of these lyrics is not possible. Mrs Whitehouse’s attempts were ultimately futile.

      Your second point is also true. The fundies will always find a pretext to kill and maim.

  • CliveM

    Prior to the atrocity I hadn’t heard of this young lady. Following it I had heard her lyrics were a bit risqué. I hadn’t heard they were down right pornographic. This is a woman who attracts a young audience of mainly girls. Isn’t it strange that many parents worry about the risks associated with the easy access of Internet porn, how it sexualises our young and leads to damaging attitudes with regards woman and sex.

    And then they take their children to listen to this woman. I bet the majority don’t get the lyrics.

    Porn isn’t just naked pictures of couples having sex, this woman is also selling porn. To young girls.

    The question asked in the title of the post is a brave one, although the term ‘smutty’ doesn’t do the lyrics justice. But it’s not a question I feel brave enough to answer. Sadly many people will deliberately misrepresent both the meaning and intention of the question, I wish HG the best.

    • IanCad

      Sadly, parents who take their charges to see such low-lifery have the right to vote.

      • Manfarang

        My friend who took his daughter to the Bangkok concert is rather conservative in his outlook.

        • CliveM

          Did he understand the lyrics?

          • Manfarang

            Of course he did.

          • CliveM

            Your definition of conservative is different to mone then.

          • Manfarang

            My friend is a staunch Tory.

          • CliveM

            Being a Tory and being conservative in your outlook are not the same thing.

          • Manfarang

            I think most people regard Tories as strong conservatives.

          • Anton

            If only.

          • Manfarang

            Let There Be Light.

          • CliveM

            Well they would be wrong. Cameron, Osborne and many others were Torys, but hardly conservative.

          • Manfarang

            One Nation Conservatives.

          • CliveM

            I’m ending this. You’re being deliberately slippery as to responding honestly to the point I’m making.

          • Manfarang

            High Tories and their worldview are sometimes at odds with the progressive elements of the Conservative Party

          • Little Black Censored

            Quite right. It is classic trolling.

        • IanCad

          If your friend’s daughter is eight years old or thereabouts I would keep a very close eye on him. It is wholly unbefitting a father to introduce his daughter to porn.

          • Manfarang

            This singer has a following among teenage girls, I don’t think any parents introduce their kids to her music.

        • Little Black Censored

          Why do you keep talking about Bangkok?

          • Manfarang

            It is the City of Angels.

          • bluedog

            He’s a mail-order husband.

          • Manfarang

            Not at all. Pornthip was in my class at college.

          • bluedog

            Congratulations!

    • Anton

      Parents who brought their offspring up so as to keep them from the sort of filth that Ariana Grande is peddling will not have lost any children in that bombing.

      • CliveM

        Well yes true. However I bet a lot of the parents who did take their daughters to the concert didn’t realise what the lyrics meant.

        It’s only relatively recently (because of being a parent) I came to understand how pervasive the porn culture has become. We are bringing up a generation of children who are being told that this sort of behaviour is the norm.

        When I was that age, songs use to be about falling in love, now they are about sex without love.

      • Linus

        I doubt it somehow.

        If I were your child and realised what a sententious, self-satisfied prig my father was, I’d be seeking any kind of alternative to his cold, unfeeling, condemnatory attitude to human suffering.

        “Serves the feckers right. Now maybe they’ll listen to ME!” leaves something to be desired in terms of love, compassion and humility, don’t you think? If I’d ever heard either of my parents dismiss other people’s suffering in such a contemptuous manner, I’d very quickly have sought guidance elsewhere.

        Look to your own children, Pixtian Pharisee. If they understand who you really are, you can be sure they’re casting around for alternatives to your rigid, condemnatory, one might almost say autistic take on morality. Ariana Grande’s siren songs may even now be teaching them another way of relating to the world.

        • Anton

          Thank you for your advice. I shall take it as seriously as it deserves.

          • Linus

            And when your kids go off the rails, it won’t be your fault, will it? How could it be, you being the perfect father with the perfect morality?

            Poor little blighters. Growing up in the shadow of a moralising narcissist. They really don’t stand a chance, do they?

          • Anton

            That you use the plural when you have no idea whether I have zero, one or more children shows that you are guessing, as ever.

          • Linus

            However many children you may have, they only have one father. My point is that he’s a sententious “told you so” and “serves you right” kind of chap.

            Not at all like Sky Pixie Jr., is he?

          • Anton

            I don’t know and neither do you. But you certainly react exactly like his opponents.

        • IrishNeanderthal

          Be glad you are not Frederick the Great of Prussia. This, The Crimes of England, may have been a bit of First World War propaganda, but you might find it rings a bell.

          I have therefore thought it advisable to provide you with a catalogue of the real crimes of England; and I have selected them on a principle which cannot fail to interest and please you. On many occasions we have been very wrong indeed. We were very wrong indeed when we took part in preventing Europe from putting a term to the impious piracies of Frederick the Great. We were very wrong indeed when we allowed the triumph over Napoleon to be soiled with the mire and blood of Blucher’s sullen savages. We were very wrong indeed when we allowed the peaceful King of Denmark to be robbed in broad daylight by a brigand named Bismarck; and when we allowed the Prussian swashbucklers to enslave and silence the French provinces which they could neither govern nor persuade. We were very wrong indeed when we flung to such hungry adventurers a position so important as Heligoland. We were very wrong indeed when we praised the soulless Prussian education and copied the soulless Prussian laws. Knowing that you will mingle your tears with mine over this record of English wrong-doing, I dedicate it to you, and I remain . . .
          . . . . . . . . .
          Everything was young once, even Frederick the Great. It was an appropriate preface to the terrible epic of Prussia that it began with an unnatural tragedy of the loss of youth. That blind and narrow savage who was the boy’s father had just sufficient difficulty in stamping out every trace of decency in him, to show that some such traces must have been there. If the younger and greater Frederick ever had a heart, it was a broken heart; broken by the same blow that broke his flute. When his only friend was executed before his eyes, there were two corpses to be borne away; and one to be borne on a high war-horse through victory after victory: but with a small bottle of poison in the pocket. It is not irrelevant thus to pause upon the high and dark house of his childhood.

          • Linus

            You’re obsessed with ancient history, aren’t you? Prussia is a country that no longer exists and German militarism is a thing of the past. Germany is now a stable, peaceful, successful partner, and as the largest and most economically dynamic EU member its influence will always be strong.

            That’s a fact of life. But the British have never been able to deal with it. You’re a jealous people and anyone who does better than you becomes the object of your envy and hatred. British anti-German sentiment is therefore to be expected. When you were our partner, we did our best to smooth over the differences and encourage you to get along with the Germans. We didn’t take sides. Now we have to.

            The battle lines are drawn and all this talk of a “deep and special relationship” is completely meaningless. We had a deep and special relationship, which you have chosen to put an end to. Future relations will be very frosty indeed.

          • bluedog

            Hopelessly confused. For whom do you speak, France or the EU – two completely different entities? If you speak for the EU and if France is to become a semi-autonomous region of a federal EU, then it is France that has left the ‘deep and special relationship’, allowing its identity to be absorbed by the EU. One somehow doubts the French will put up with this for very long, any more than the Dutch, Danes, Poles and Hungarians. Then there’s the Irish, too.

          • Linus

            France is a part of the EU, so I speak for both. European integration will continue, all the faster thanks to the UK’s departure. Our deep and special relationship with our European partners will deepen further and become a unbreakable bond. Indeed it already has. Our relationship with Britain will become more distant and distrustful. You’re a rival now. You’re no longer part of the family.

            France’s belief in Europe was clearly expressed during our last presidential election. The FN offered a vision of separate and warring nation states that belongs to the past. That way was resoundingly rejected by the French electorate. Macron’s vision of deepening European integration was massively approved.

            We understand that we can be French and European at the same time, just as you can be English and British. There is no contradiction in multiple identities coming together in a common identity. Some member states with difficult histories of domination and oppression, such as Ireland or Hungary or Poland, may find it too great a step to take to become part of a whole when they haven’t yet satisfied their need to be seperate and autonomous. They may also choose to go their own way. But the core nations will hold firm and unite because in unity we see the best path forward.

            The British want to see us fail and will do their best to undermine and destabilise us. This is why they must be kept at arm’s length. I’ll be supporting policies that seek to keep our contact and trade with an independent Britain to a minimum. We need to concentrate on our European partners. We need a tariff wall and tight immigration controls between us and foreign nations who want to profit from us for their own selfish ends.

          • Brian

            But the issue as it appears to me is this. The ‘European idea’ was at heart a Catholic vision, a kind of repristination of Christendom after the horrors of WWII – and a bulwark against Soviet Communism. And there was some revival of Catholicism in western Europe in the reconstruction years, before a strong secularisation kicked in from the 1960s onward; and what weakened Catholicism was not Darwinism (it had already made a kind of peace with that), but a growing sexual libertinism in popular culture which could only separate young people from the Church; and with the passage of a generation and more perhaps the majority of French have grown up without any real engagement with the Catholic Church. The children of nominal Catholics are usually not even nominal themselves. And once again the indigenous French birth rate plummeted (as it had in the 19th century), but this time modern medicine and welfare kept more older people alive. Meanwhile, immigration from North Africa had created a new and very different presence in France – unlike, say, Hungarians or Poles who shared Catholic culture and would be fully French in a generation. The atrocities of Charlie Hebdo, Bataclan, Nice etc show the bifurcation in the French soul. If the typical young French person in his or her 20s will soon be of North African Muslim heritage, what kind of France will you have in the next 10 or so years?

          • Linus

            Arabs form a small minority of less than 10%. That’s fewer than one in ten of the population. There is no “bifurcation in the French soul”. That’s an invention of the Far Right created by nationalists and demagogues who hate everything that doesn’t conform to their narrow, white, heterosexual, right-wing ideal.

            The EU is a secular organisation founded on secular principles. France is a secular republic. In 10 years time it will still be a secular republic within a more highly integrated secular EU. The hysterical prophecies of low-brow populist authors like Houellebecq who paint a nightmare picture of a Pixlim takeover are no more serious than the 19th century Yellow Peril nonsense, or the Zionist plot. Immigrants do not “breed like rabbits”. Their birth rates fall into line with the general population within a couple of generations. At current growth rates Pixlims will never exceed 10% of the population. A 10% does not a “bifurcation” make.

          • Anton

            What proportion of a population does it take to enact a takeover? Any Frenchman will know that revolutions are led by the most zealous.

            So you are happy with the way France is going? How many Islamic atrocities were there in the 1990s, in the decade from 2000, and in the present decade?

          • Linus

            Leaders who slaughter indiscriminately in an attempt to impose their religion on a populace that does not believe in it tend to be rather unsuccessful at fomenting revolution.

            There is no revolutionary fervour in France because we French are happy with our basic form of government and even if we may disagree with particular policies or trends, we don’t disagree with the way our democracy works.

            Half a dozen radical Pixlamists committing terrorist acts have no more chance of toppling our government than the IRA had of “freeing” Northern Ireland during its 1970s bombing campaigns. Last time I looked, Ulster was still British and the IRA hadn’t succeeded in changing that. But according to your reckoning, they should have.

            After all, Catholics breed like rabbits, don’t they? Or do they? Whilst remaining socially Catholic, is the truth not that Catholics use birth control just as much as anyone else, which means their population in Northern Ireland is stable and will not swamp the Protestants in a flood of Papist babies?

            What about Pixlim women in France? Do they breed like rabbits too, or do they do exactly what every ethnic group that obtains access to contraception always does and limit the size of their families?

            Look to your own country. How many Pixlim families with 20 children (or 10 or even 5) do you see running around the streets of the town where you live?

            Immigrant birth rates fall to host country average levels with a couple of generations at most. France’s Pixlim minority will not grow. It will not swamp us in a flood of Pixlim babies and turn our nation into a Pixlamic republic. Only in your tortured and (for a soi-disant scientist) totally illogical mind that ignores clear and compelling evidence in favour of blind prejudice and dogma can such a fantasy be made real.

          • bluedog

            With 47% of its GDP derived from export activity, the German SAR cannot afford your Trumpian teriff wall.

          • Linus

            The tariff wall will only apply to British products. We already trade relatively freely with the US and China. But an independent Britain is a Trojan horse that needs to be kept outside the gates.

          • IrishNeanderthal

            You really have no idea of who you are replying to.

            Prussia is a country that no longer exists and German militarism is a thing of the past.

            I am well aware of that. I was in no way getting at today’s Germans. In fact, I find the silly anti-German humour on British media, from the Goon Show onwards, quite annoying. Moreover, I cannot think of any post-war British comedian of the stature of Heinz Erhardt.

            And as Simon Cowell said, when the audience booed a German contestant of Britain’s Got Talent, “That was seventy years ago. We’re friends now.”

            Not talking about sex, you seem to lack any natural affections. I cannot detect in your communications any sign of love, or even affection for, France.

            To treat you to some real ancient history, here, slightly modified to fit your comments here, is an epigram from the Roman poet Martial:

            Tongilianus has a spleen — I know, I don’t deny it.
            But then —Tongilianus has nothing but a spleen.

          • Anton

            You’re letting him off lightly if that’s the only Martial you are quoting at him!

            Georg Kreisler was pretty good, but he was Austrian.

          • Maxine Schell

            Such an idiot !

          • Linus

            Such a Pixtian! In fact an eminently typical one. A judgmental, abusive, arrogant old woman who thinks she knows better than everyone else.

        • Inspector General

          One is sure he could have spent a very pleasant afternoon in a pub in your father’s company…

          “And how’s your son”

          “As he always is. Asocial, amoral and queer. The finest example of narcissism you’ll ever come across.”

        • Little Black Censored

          Gosh, even nastier than usual.

        • Maxine Schell

          What is a “Pixtian” ? ……some British thing ?

          • CliveM

            Linus liked to pretend he’s French.

          • Linus

            A Pixtian is a follower of the Sky Pixie. Don’t you even know what you are?

            Such an idiot!

    • cagedvole

      sickening to see it widely represented as an attack on starry-eyed little girls just there to have innocent fun. I knew nothing about this singer previously, either. After I had looked her up, I felt I could see exactly why the occasion was targeted.

      Those children SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN THERE.

  • Sarky

    Lighten up. Smut has been around for years, even from our so called greatest.

    SIR ANDREW
    But it becomes me well enough, does ’t not?
    SIR TOBY BELCH
    Excellent; it hangs like flax on a distaff; and I
    hope to see a housewife take thee between her legs
    and spin it off.

    • CliveM

      Smut i dont mind particularly. Shakespeare is for adults. Or do you think singing songs about wanking men off to 11 year olds a simply smut and acceptable?

      • Sarky

        The music is not for kids, that they are allowed to buy it is down to the parents.
        Mine ask me before they download anything!!

        • Anton

          What age group do you think Grande and her distributors are expecting to make most money from?

          • Sarky

            Teenagers. And again, parents should take responsibility for their childrens listening habits.

          • Manfarang

            Doesn’t matter what responsibility the parents take. A lot of peer pressure.

          • carl jacobs

            Teenagers are kids.

          • Mark

            Depends. When I was a teen….”Mum, take a listen to this!”
            It was The Jam, and the song had the line of “I don’t give two f*cks about your review…”
            She listened. Then said, “Okay. Want a cup of tea?”
            The same thing happened a year later with an incredibly rude comedy record by Peter Cook and Dudley Moore.

            Rebellion? No chance.

            I wonder what happens if a parent goes through the roof at that point?

            But on the “wrist icicle” thing, I’d probably bet that kids either don’t listen to the lyrics properly or even understand them (I didn’t). Having found out what it means though, I am frowning a bit.

        • CliveM

          Depends of your definition of kids. But the youngest victim of the attacks was 8.

          I agree that it’s the parents responsibility to monitor what the children are listening to.

          I don’t see however how any of this supports your contention it’s simply smut and not important.

          • Sarky

            Because it is unimportant.

            This conversation happens every generation. When i was a kid it was ‘relax’ by frankie goes to hollywood.

          • CliveM

            Sarky you’re all muddled. You first argued it was simply harmless smut, you then said it was parents responsibility to monitor listening habits (why if it’s harmless smut?), then you say it acceptable simply because it’s happened before!

            You don’t address the moral aspect of this, precedent doesn’t mean something is right. This isn’t smut it’s porn. It does matter because it gives young people a mistaken understanding of what relationships should be about and what behaviour is acceptable. Porn is poisoning our children in a way it hasn’t previously because of the Internet. It’s made it anonymous and readily available in a way it wasn’t when we were young. It does matter.

          • Sarky

            If you leave your childs education to music and the internet, that’s your problem.

            The bottom line is, if you don’t like it, dont let your kids listen to it.
            My guess is most kids wouldn’t even understand it.

          • CliveM

            Now Sarky don’t get tetchy simply because you’re unwilling to answer my question. Where have I said that I’ve left my kids to get their education from music and the Internet?

            The fact you appear to be saying you would police these lyrics suggest you think it important. Why then are you saying it’s not and simply smut?

          • Sarky

            Because in the grand scheme of things it is meaningless.
            I am pretty liberal in what my kids listen to, although i would feel uncomfortable with them listening to anything blatant.

          • CliveM

            So if I understand you right, singing about wanking a man off to children is alright because it doesn’t matter and even if it did the audience don’t understand?

          • Sarky

            Did you?

          • CliveM

            Did I what?

          • Sarky

            Know what it meant?

          • CliveM

            You’ll need to tell me.

        • CliveM

          Also you haven’t answered my question about how you would catagorise lyrics about wanking men off and do you see it as acceptable for a concert for young girls and teenagers?

        • Royinsouthwest

          While parental responsibility is important there are severe practical limits to what parents can achieve. You don’t have to buy music to be able to listen to it. You can hear it on the radio with far more channels available now than even in the hey day of pirate radio in the 1960s, or on the Internet. Although payment is required for some music streaming services on the Internet the basic version of Spotify is free to users, paid for by advertisements.

          A lot of music is also freely available on You Tube including the song by Ariana Grande with the lyrics that His Grace mentioned. The words of the lyrics are displayed in the video to make it more obvious what she is singing about.

          • Sarky

            Even with the lyrics its not obvious.

    • And was no more justified then than now.

    • Little Black Censored

      Are you and Linus working shifts?

      • Sarky

        Hell yeah!!!

  • Mrs Proudie of Barchester

    This is a revelation, Your Grace. Here in Barchester we have few secular concerts, just choral evensong with Mr.Harding conducting. As for sins of the flesh, we have hot water bottles and find they suffice.

    • bluedog

      One frets that your use of a hot water bottle made of India rubber may be an anachronism, Mrs P. Would you not be using a bed-warming pan made of hand-beaten copper, filled with hot ashes from a fire? One trusts that such a device would not prove inhibiting.

      • Mrs Proudie of Barchester

        “India rubber” hot water bottles were in use in Britain at least by 1875

        • bluedog

          Isn’t that eighteen years after Mrs Proudie’s debut?

          • Mrs Proudie of Barchester

            I was re-issued

          • bluedog

            A woman’s prerogative.

          • Pubcrawler

            Deluxe, leather binding?

    • Manfarang

      I bet Mr. Slope has visited Paris dance halls.

  • Inspector General

    Not very nice, but then corruption of the spirit is what humanity does well.

    And then Islam showed up here…

    Left alone, the Inspector is in no doubt that over the decades, the corruption of England would have been complete in the end. A quarter of the population drugged out of its mind with the government’s blessing. Homosexual hardcore allowed on terrestrial TV. Live sex shows passing off as Saturday night entertainment. The lyrics of Ariana Grande studied in school. Boys encouraged to become girls. So much more. What once appeared as fantastic, in the literal sense, has become reality.

    And then Islam showed up here…

    In a space of a few years, the biggest danger to this country since Hitler has every single one of us scared, for ourselves, our family, our future. It has us evaluating, in a way we have forgotten. Ariana Grande will be evaluated and found to be what she appears. A sexual degenerate.

    Islam may well be the saving of us. The price paid, and don’t forget, there are future instalments to pay, won’t be cheap. But it will be worth it. Very worth it. Even if your very own Inspector is marked down as a future terrorist casualty. Such is the love he has for this country.

    • CliveM

      Man up Inspector, don’t let Islam frighten you, tsk, tsk. Being frightened of little things like that didn’t win us an Empire. Look at it as a challenge.

      • Inspector General

        Exactly Clive. It’s a challenge. Man needs a challenge. He just does. We haven’t had much of a challenge since the Soviet Union collapsed. Look what’s happened to us in just 25 years…

        By the way, we stand a greater chance of being murdered by Islam that winning the National Lottery. People have and will continue to win the lottery, despite the amazing odds involved, and each draw, your Inspector has one chance.

        • CliveM

          Really how many lottery winners this year v number killed by terrorists in the U.K.?

          • Inspector General

            Had to withdraw statement Clive. Unable to verify.

  • A Berean

    “Do smutty and sexual Ariana Grande lyrics increase the risk of terrorism?”

    No. But it provides a very convenient excuse for those to commit such atrocities. According to them Western civilization is the very epitome of decadence and immorality. If you don’t behave and/or dress in the way prescribed by your Muslim betters then they have no other option than to admonish (read kill) you for your immoral lifestyle while politicians and others are only too happy to declare that it is not the terrorists themselves that are responsible for blowing themselves up amongst those that support and engage in such immoral and reckless behavior but the societies themselves are responsible for the terrorists behavior. Apparently, according to them, we are reaping what we are sowing.

    • Manfarang

      I didn’t get killed in the Middle East for not wearing Arab Muslim dress.

      • Anton

        What did you get killed for?

        • Manfarang

          I didn’t get killed. Cities in the Gulf are very safe.

          • Mark

            Good to hear that you are still around

          • Manfarang

            Last week I spoke to a young lady who was a Muslim. A very nice person who would never harm anyone.

        • Pubcrawler

          He didn’t get where he is today.

  • Dreadnaught

    Protecting kids from exposure to crude lyrics in pop music if totally the responsibility of parents. It wont block out completely of course, that is an impossibility but they are the only ones who can educate them as to what they are listening and singing to.
    As to the ISIS aspect; they need no excuses to instigate murder as a reaction to this or anything else, their murder programme is set default as any cowardly random acts an appropriate Muslim sets mind to.

    • It is the responsibility of parents. But it is also the responsibility of any others who influence children to guard them from such coarseness. It is the responsibility of the pop industry to warn of sexually explicit lyrics. It is the responsibility of A Grande not to sing such corrupting lyrics. It is the responsibility of censors to advocate censorship of pornographic images… and so on.

      • Dreadnaught

        No to State censorship.

        • You’ll notice I didn’t say State and said advocate rather than unilaterally impose. Actually however, there is always an element of State censorship and porn should surely be part of it.

          • Dreadnaught

            Whom else but the State can enforce compliance to censorship rules or unilaterally define the what and how of what will be censored.

          • Yet, in a healthy democracy they can only censor what the people approve.

            I understand the concerns about censorship but feel we veer in the opposite direction. After all, TV has measures of censorship it must adhere to. The only problem is this is not strict enough.

          • CliveM

            Let’s be honest, unless we ran a state like N. Koea, censorship in the new internet era is almost a complete waste of time. Yes the BBC has to abide by rules, but look where children are going for their entertainment, YouTube and the like.

            Censorship is a ship that’s sailed.

          • Simon Platt

            Oh, I don’t know. Try saying “nigger”.

          • Anton

            You can’t even say it if you’re black now!

          • Simon Platt

            At least you can say it here.

          • betteroffoutofit

            Lawks a Massy! Talk about “Mucked up Latin”!!!
            All the forbidden word means is “black” – from Fr. “nègre,” itself from Spanish/Portuguese negro “black,” both those being derived from Latin (adj) “niger, nigra, nigrum “black, dark-coloured”,” and/or the verb “nigrare = to be black,” and the noun “nigror, -oris m. meaning “blackness.”

            Certainly, figurative and other connotations indicate “gloomy, unlucky, bad, wicked,” which etymonline quotes as being “of unknown origin (perhaps from PIE *nekw-t- “night;” see Watkins)”. That doesn’t mean, though, that we’re all marxist claptrap artists who apply those characteristics to skin colour and race.

            However, in that dominant climate, one may be forgiven for understanding “White” as the new “Black”!!!!
            All of which once more brings to mind for me: “Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!” (Isaiah 5:20; KJV).
            [[And “them” would include the vile Ariana and other propagators of fake music.]]

            __________________________________________________________
            Watkins, Calvert, ed., “The American Heritage Dictionary of Indo-European Roots. 2nd ed. Houghton Mifflin Co., 2000. Qtd. in: http://etymonline.com/index.php?allowed_in_frame=0&search=negro.

            cf. also “Cassell’s Latin Dictionary.”

          • Maxine Schell

            In the new prints, Tom Sawyer (Mark Twain) doesn’t say it.

          • True.

          • IrishNeanderthal

            You’ll be lucky.

            The Censor of Plays is a small and accidental eighteenth-century official. . . . . The origin of the thing was in truth purely political. Its first and principal achievement was to prevent Fielding from writing plays; not at all because the plays were coarse, but because they criticised the Government. Fielding was a free writer; but they did not resent his sexual freedom; the Censor would not have objected if he had torn away the most intimate curtains of decency or rent the last rag from private life. What the Censor disliked was his rending the curtain from public life. There is still much of that spirit in our country; there are no affairs which men seek so much to cover up as public affairs.

            The Dramatist, from George Bernard Shaw, by G. K. Chesterton

  • Norman Yardy

    Even if there was no terrorism these lyrics would still be offensive, particularly for young children.

  • IrishNeanderthal

    Since the Sixties, it is quite likely that the sordidness of post-war Western civilization does make some people turn towards Islam.

    “My life has been a source of intrigue for a lot of people, including me!” laughs grey-bearded pop legend Yusuf Islam. His story is, indeed, one of the strangest in rock ’n’ roll: the religious conversion of soulful singer-songwriter Cat Stevens at the height of his Seventies fame, which saw him turn his back on a music world of “sin and greed” for 25 years, before eventually returning under his new adopted name. “The world changed, so I changed. But the centre of me has always been the same, looking for peace,” he says.

    Yusuf Islam interview: ‘I don’t want people saying this is Islam’s new record’However, one could argue, British Rail fashion, that some of them have run into “the wrong type of Islam”.

  • carl jacobs

    The root of Islamic (not just Islamist) enmity is the fact that the internal vision of Islam does not coincide with Islamic reality. Islam is by and large associated with poverty, ignorance, and weakness. There is a huge overlap between Islam and the Third world. Islam does not possess the metaphysical tools to explain this state of affairs. Islam is supposed to dominate. So Islamic weakness gets put down to conspiracy and manipulation by certain hostile agents who have deprived Islam of its rightful place (i.e. Jews, Westerners, did I mention the dirty filthy Jews?). Islamists compensate by picking up AK47s. The danger is that 10 people with weapons can control 1000 people without weapons. You don’t need a lot of Islamists to create a large threat.

    The Secular World sees religion as incidental because it perceives religion to be transitory and passing away. It naively assumes all men are naturally converging towards the secular Star Trekian paradise envisioned by Gene Roddenberry. This assumes the inevitable emergence of a common underlying worldview that is independent of religion. In this view Islam is not a threat. It will quickly follow the path of Christianity in the West and secularism into non -existence. What secularists wish to pull out root and branch are the deep Christian sources remaining in Western culture. These are the actual barriers to secularization.

    So they ignore the burgeoning threat. And what if Islam doesn’t follow the script written for it? Well, it just must, that’s all. It’s been foretold in the secular vision of man’s inevitable progress. After all, there is no god, and Roddenberry is his prophet.

    • Manfarang

      Wahabi oil money is closer to the root of the enmity.

      • Pubcrawler

        Money is the enabler; the root is the ideology.

    • CliveM

      Yes good point. India and Pakistan make an interesting contrast and underline your point.

    • Sarky

      Beam me up scotty!

      • carl jacobs

        Didya ever notice how the really powerful (dare I say godlike) aliens in Star Trek (confer with “The Squire of Gothos” for an example) turned out be really benign? That wasn’t an accident. Malignant powerful aliens would overthrow the whole vision. The Star Trek vision is a vision of man’s dominance and ascendancy. Can’t have that of you are being enslaved by an alien race that views you as little more than an insect.

    • dannybhoy

      “The Secular World sees religion as incidental because it perceives religion to be transitory and passing away. It naively assumes all men are naturally converging towards the secular Star Trekian paradise envisioned by Gene Roddenberry.”
      Quite right. It’s all about world views, and by and large the West assumes that everybody admires and envies Western prosperity and freedom. Which in the main is true. But what we fail to grasp is that other cultures envy what we have but neither understand nor understand how we got there.
      And no amount of exposure to or inclusion in our society will change that.

      • Maxine Schell

        And here in US, they do not appreciate what we have, or understand how we got here.
        i.e.: Antifa……a wave of ignorance and violence.

  • Dreadnaught

    Protecting kids from exposure to crude lyrics in pop music is totally the responsibility of parents. It wont block out completely of course, that is an impossibility but they are the only ones who can educate them as to what they are listening and singing to.
    As to the ISIS aspect; they need no excuses to instigate murder as a reaction to this or anything else, their murder programme is set default as any cowardly random acts an appropriate Muslim sets mind to.

  • Anton

    …and gave up the faith. How about the others?

    • Sarky

      Same. Although I’m not in contact with any of them now.

  • John

    I grew up in the seventies when, in the pop world, men had long hair, wore high heels and make up and sang about immoral sex. It went over my head completely. Ariana Grande’s lyrics will be the same for prepubescent girls today I’m sure. “Walk on the Wild Side” by Lou Reed for this 12 year-old was just a nice tune with a catchy drum and bass riff – it’s only now that I know that this is about bizarre transsexual experimentation and totally not OK for children to be exposed to.

    • Anton

      That Lou Reed song turned me off simply because of how cool he was obviously trying to be.

    • Marcus Stewart

      Sure; and in the sex-gender confusion that absurd liberals are creating to realise their “project” (whatever it is), Christians must be critical, for children are being harmed. This isn’t about decency about, and acceptance of, homosexuality, which is “difference,” but denial of fundamental difference – male and female. It’s absurd; and I await the inevitable court cases about assault/voyeurism mixed-sex loos in school will bring, in the hope that foolish heads who implemented this (I thought schools had no money?) will be prosecuted for creating vulnerability.

  • Mark

    Corbyn’s comment

    “Over the past fifteen years or so, a sub-culture of often suicidal violence has developed amongst a tiny minority of, mainly young, men, falsely drawing authority from Islamic beliefs……”

    My emphasis. The mistake of far too many people, over such a long time. Leave out the word “falsely” and you are that much closer to the truth, and understanding why they do it.

    • Anton

      Impressive that Corbyn understands Islam so much better than all those imams.

      • Marcus Stewart

        Quite. The PC brigade insist on telling imams – us all – that they know better what was meant and what ought to be (for Islam, often as apologists). Eisegesis: “to lead into,” injecting one’s own ideas into the text, making it mean whatever is wanted.

  • Mark

    I learn about “wrist icicle” for the first time in all my years.

    • A Berean

      One of many unpleasant, if not disturbing, things one learns about while reading His Grace’s postings.

      • Mark

        At least it wasn’t a “nose icicle”

        • CliveM

          Have you ever heard the term ‘pearl necklace’?!

          • Mark

            That did exist and was fairly widely known about back in my youth. It was treated as a bit of a joke term, more than anything else though.

          • CliveM

            Strangely i was in my 30’s when i heard of it! Im a bit slow on the uptake.

          • Mark

            How about the term “Wobbly Christmas Cracker”?

          • Maxine Schell

            I am 86, and just now learning any of it! Thankfully uneducated.

          • CliveM

            There are many things in life we are not better off for knowing.

      • Pubcrawler

        Probably best you steer clear of Roger’s Profanisaurus, then.

        • Mark

          “Crafty Butcher” anyone? Straight out of Roger’s Profanisaurus.

          • Pubcrawler

            Not for me, thanks.

    • Marcus Stewart

      I shudder to think…

    • len

      Sometimes ignorance is bliss.

  • David

    Yes the countries of the west have encouraged sexual debasement and depravity to become, not just permissible, but celebrated. We are Sodom and Gomorrah. In this conservative Islam is correct to criticise us, though they too are guilty, but of different sins.
    Regarding foreign wars these should only be fought to protect our necessary and justified interests and not to further the ambitions of globalist powers intent on world control , or the profits to be made from using up military hardware.
    However Corbin is a hypocrite. Given the violent history of Islam deliberately importing milions of Muslims, some from very backward cultures, to boost Labour’s electoral chances, it is inevitable that such millions will include those hundreds or even thousands prepared to spread the control of Sharia by violence.
    The fact that we have been both importing Muslims whilst attacking Muslim majority countries shows the total lack of strategic direction in our inadequate political leaders, incapable of joining up the dots and seeing a coherent whole.

    It is well past time to reassert the clear superiority of the west’s basic values , to be rescued from the excesses of individualism and sexual confusions and debauchery, and to reestablish the vital support of the Judaeo- Christian value system, based on individual faith in God.

  • Marcus Stewart

    I wholeheartedly agree. The bifurcated “narrative” now is that Islam is unconscionable (except to the PC liberals, schizoid and conflicted about it – would that they were about Christianity…); Western “values” (what are they?) laudable. Alas, it’s not so simple. Ms Grande attracted much positive publicity for her post-atrocity action (laudable, I’m sure); but if parents bothered to engage with what their offspring are hearing/enjoying/approving I’d hope that at least some would be less sympathetic to the exhortation to the whoring that precisely coloured the view of those disgusting men – mainly Muslim – who abused just these kinds of girls by treating them as under-age whores. Worse, some parents themselves probably enjoy this tripe.

    While I want people to be free to choose to sing about whoring, to listen to it and to do it, I want them to make (morally) informed choice – and that’s the rub in the free West. Informed choice is made when free agents can in principle (even if misguided in practice) appraise competing claims, including those of Christians and others about why whoring (or whatever) may be wrong. But Christians are themselves somewhat unconscionable in these days of Wonderland ethics.

    • Manfarang

      “narrative” Another misuse of the English language.

    • ‘While I want people to be free to choose to sing about whoring, to listen to it and to do it,’

      Why is this a desirable freedom? There are lots of things that are forbidden and censored by the State, why not these which are so destructive of humanity and society?

      • Anton

        Careful John. I ave no wish to draw cartoons of Muhammad but a strong wish to live in a society where it is not illegal.

        • I understand. And I agree. But as I said above societies do practice a degree of censorship. TV has a degree of censorship. Society has a responsibility to censor at various levels pornography and prurience. But yes, I recognise the dangers.

          But, to be mischievous, I thought you believed the OT law was a model for modern state law. Censorship was strong in OT law.

          • Anton

            I believe that the laws governing interpersonal relationships – so-called moral laws – remain valid precedent because human nature hasn’t changed. Other Mosaic laws cannot be so simply applied.

  • Mark

    Me neither. I just made it up, but am having fun in my own little mind, trying to find something to apply it to.

    • CliveM

      Ah, ok………..!

  • Anton

    Ariana Grande and her like are why 2nd generation Muslims in this country are *less* integrated than their parents, who vowed “we don’t want this filth in our community”. Who can blame them?

  • Dodgy Geezer

    …a sub-culture of often suicidal violence has developed amongst a tiny minority of, mainly young, men, falsely drawing authority from Islamic beliefs…

    I fear that you will find that dying while fighting against unbelievers is a much approved Islamic belief, and hardly false.

    Mind you, our chaplains used to ‘speed glum heroes up the line to death’ a hundred years ago, so I suppose we’re just as bad…

  • Royinsouthwest

    It is quite possible that obscene lyrics help to convince some Muslims, and not just those who approve of violence, that the West is degenerate but there worse examples of decadence. Ariana Grande’s lyrics are not, as far as I know, studied for a GCSE in English and cannot be said to have official approval. In contrast the current trans-mania gripping schools and the BBC does have official approval. There is an article about this at the Conservative Women website involving a Church of England school.

    What chance have these brave parents against the transgender thought police?
    https://www.conservativewoman.co.uk/caroline-farrow-chance-brave-parents-transgender-thought-police/

    Caroline Farrow, the author of the article, describes how the parents who objected to the school’s bizarre new policy were asked how they know that their own children are boys! When they gave the common sense answer they were accused of making the whole issue all about genitals – as if sex is a merely a matter of opinion and not of biology. The lunatics may not be in charge of the asylum but they are certainly getting a grip on educational policy.

    The newspapers and broadcasting organisations are that most ready to find excuses for Islamic terrorism, such as the Guardian and BBC, should add the policy of gender confusion, which they support, to the list of excuses but, of course, it is highly unlikely that they will do that.

  • Inspector General

    Ariana Grande makes the Inspector think of pirates around the eastern seaboard of the Americas, and the Spanish whores they took with them. For some reason he cannot ascertain. Perhaps it’s the lyrics she spouts…or maybe her visible bra.

    • Chefofsinners

      I am surprised you do not immediately think of the Arian heresy, one of your personal favourites.

      • Inspector General

        The Higher Understanding thanks you for your quip and wonders what else apart from poly-deism you would like to salvage from paganism…

    • Pubcrawler

      At least she’s keeping her ears nicely warm.

    • andrew

      She also converted from Catholicism to mystical Judaism, though which branch I’m unsure. Say no more.

      • Brian

        Kobbolas, I think.

  • It will be interesting to see the reaction of muslim parents to their babies, toddlers and infants having stories about trans-sexual fairies told them by grotesque looking trannies in their nurseries and schools to normalise this. There was an item again in the 6 o’clock news on ITV. The media are doing their best to push this rubbish on us. I feel sorry for anyone with dependent children now, they are being dangerously brainwashed.

  • Martin

    Maybe indirectly by means of God allowing atrocities to occur as judgement. And not just atrocities.

  • Chefofsinners

    Why must UK foreign policy be changed, but our sex-obsessed culture not?
    Because politics is the art of the possible. It is about humans solving their own problems through the means within their control.
    Comedy Corbyn cannot turn the tides of culture, or change human nature. Only God can do that. Until Christ reigns there will be sin and suffering and wars. Being nice to jihadis is not going to stop them attacking us.

    • Anton

      It’s not, but should our boys have been sent to Iraq and Afghanistan? Policing those spaces is a superpower job and, while we diplomatically should support the Superpower that went in, we should have left it at that. That same superpower was determined to get us out of every other country than our own in living memory, after all.

      • Chefofsinners

        The enemy of my enemy is my friend. Alliances are crucial for survival in the modern world.

      • carl jacobs

        Well there was also that whole problem of the UK being bankrupt after WWII and electing a Labor Gov’t. But in any case, you should be thankful the UK supported us. If the whole of Europe had abandoned the US at that moment, I wonder if NATO would still exist.

        Europe is a collection of faithless hangers on – willing to defend their Welfare state to the last American. Except for the UK. And why do I feel that way? Because of Iraq.

        • Anton

          Regarding the cause in Iraq, I have read plenty on this blog and off it and would rather just agree to disagree with you about the theat Saddam presented and how to deal with it. Regarding the motivation of the UK, I have one warning for any American: DO NOT TRUST TONY BLAIR.

          • carl jacobs

            It’s not about Iraq or Blair. It’s about the purpose of NATO. Would I be far wrong if I said that Europeans believe NATOs purpose is to get the Americans to defend Europe so Europeans don’t have to?

            I’m a hawk. Yet I already support scrapping NATO and refashioning the Alliance along much narrower terms. I want to force Europe to carry its weight. When people like me get hostile, your base of support is eroding. If the collective whole of Europe has flipped off the US in 2001, the reaction would have been “Our loyal allies …. You are all the f___ing French!”

            That would not have been a good place for Europe to be. Especially since the US had involved itself in the Balkans just a few years earlier for the express reason of maintaining NATO solidarity.

          • Anton

            UK commitment with tangible force to NATO is the good reason for UK/US relations to be warm. Not Iraq, in my opinion, and certainly not Bosnia, where Clinton’s meddling has left us with a Muslim State in Europe. I don’t judge the US by Clinton, however.

            The contradiction that the USA ran into in Afghanistan was that you can’t impose democracy – however well-meaning you are – in a place where losers of elections simply pick up AK47s. The only way for Washington to have run the place was the way Britain had run the more primitive parts of its Empire, but that wouldn’t have been politically acceptable given that Washington has always ranked anti-colonialism very highly indeed (more highly, in fact, than the possibility of an anti-communist alliance with the British Empire after WW2, which could have been superb). Some Brits feel schadenfreude about the Us experience in Afghanistan. Not me. But the situation is a pity.

          • carl jacobs

            UK commitment with tangible force to NATO, far more than the Continentals, is the good reason for UK/US relations to be warm.

            You don’t get points for providing forces to help defend your own continent. That’s called table stakes.

          • Maxine Schell

            Bush was very “simple” on 2 counts……that Irac would jump at the chance to have a democracy, and that “Islam is a religion of peace”

          • Maxine Schell

            This Yank also favors scrapping NATO.

          • Manfarang

            Saddam wasn’t a threat to the Iraqi Christians.

          • Linus

            For a Pixtian who’s supposed to love and forgive his enemies, you sure do go in for bitter and judgmental vendettas, don’t you?

            But then it’s always a case of “do what I say, not what I do” with you, isn’t it?

          • Anton

            Hello sexular humanist, do you think Tony Blair is/was trustworthy?

          • Linus

            I think Tony Blair is a politician. And one who is no better or worse than most of his kind. His “crime” was to hold on to power long enough for the consequences of his acts to boomerang back on him while he was still in office, or relatively soon after he left it. You hate him because he did things you hate and has the temerity still to be alive and be living in relative luxury while you struggle both with a limited income and (severely) limited influence.

            The moral of this story is that the wise politician will eschew office until he’s old enough to be dead within a few years of leaving it.

            If Blair has one lesson to teach Macron, it would be to prepare for a lifetime of vilification once his term of office is over. If he’s only in his mid-forties when he leaves the Elysée, he’s going to face a good 30-40 years of scapegoating and mudslinging, which will make for a very unpleasant life. Perhaps it’s a good thing his wife probably won’t have to suffer for that long as well.

        • Maxine Schell

          And thankless hangers on.

    • carl jacobs

      Why must UK foreign policy be changed, but our sex-obsessed culture not?

      Silly Chef. Because being a sexual libertine is an inalienable right of autonomous man.

      • Chefofsinners

        Yes. Unfortunately autonomous woman tends to be less interested.

        • carl jacobs

          But … autonomous man has an inalienable right to access to the favors of autonomous woman. If it were not so, then his right to libertine sexual gratification wouldn’t be inalienable. Someone should contact the ECHR.

          Things sure get complicated in this post modern world.

  • grutchyngfysch

    Sort of ironic that the originators of the phrase “useful idiots” are now precisely that to another ideology.

  • David

    Amidst all this debasement I point to good news, very good news ! For an article in Breitbart reports continuing explosive growth of Christianity in China, especially amongst the underground Catholic and Protestant churches. It’s estimated that there are now 100 million Christians. The government continues to ramp up the p ersecution against them, but as we believers know from our history this will only strengthen the growth of the faith. Christianity is unstoppable once The Holy Spirit leads us. Praise be to God !

    • Manfarang

      There are lots of Merry Christmas signs in the shops during the winter.

  • Lucius

    It has nothing to do with UK policy or pop culture. ISIS stated plainly its reasons for waging war on the West in Issue #15 of Dabiq, its regular publication. In the article titled, “Why We Hate You & Why We Fight You” at page 30, ISIS states: “We hate you, first and foremost, because you are disbelievers … Furthermore, just as your disbelief is the primary reason we hate you, your disbelief is the primary reason we fight you.”

    ISIS also reminds the reader that until the West submits to Allah there can be no lasting peace: “Apart from the option of a temporary truce, this is the only likely scenario that would bring you fleeting respite from our attacks. So in the end, you cannot bring an indefinite halt to our war against you. At most, you could only delay it temporarily.”

    Personally, I take them at their word. I encourage you all to read the entire article, which I have linked below.

    https://clarionproject.org/factsheets-files/islamic-state-magazine-dabiq-fifteen-breaking-the-cross.pdf

    • Manfarang

      Daesh is being defeated in a ground war in Iraq and Syria and being closed down on the internet and social media.

      • len

        Daesh is not defeated, one head has been cut off the monster but it is growing another.

        • Manfarang

          Measures are being taken in British jails to prevent the radicalization of young criminals. Kashmir, Rakhine. southern Thailand, and the southern Philippines are long standing conflicts.

          • Anton

            Government has been taking measures outside jail to to prevent the radicalization of young Muslims and a fat lot of good they have done. Why might it be different inside?

          • Manfarang

            Segregation.

          • len

            IS fighters have free access to Europe now and are using knives and trucks to kill when they cannot get arms to continue their killing.
            The internet is also being used to promote IS and other radical groups and to radicalize others into terrorist activities.
            There are thousands of potential terrorists and the authorities cannot keep tabs on them all.

          • Pubcrawler

            Yebbut Manfarang has an anecdote about meeting a sweet Muslim lady once so really there’s nothing to worry about.

          • Manfarang

            There are millions of them.

          • Chefofsinners

            Anecdotes? Spare us.

  • Jonathan Tedd

    Imagine the abuse I would get as a latter day Mary Whitehouse (she was right wasn’t she? Let’s admit it) from the media?

    We let sex out of the bottle, it begat gay rights and now we have gender fluid children.

    What more justification do you need as moderate Muslim let alone a extreme one?

    There will be more converts to Islam by English people – a lot more. You don’t get the abuse by the media for your beliefs like Christians do.

    • Manfarang

      The numbers of English people becoming Muslims is small. Christians being abused because of their faith is nothing new.

      • andrew

        As UK muslim majority cities become the norm and Christianity declines, many English will undoubtedly convert to Islam. Shoddy theology aside, most English today are religiously illiterate, and theological consistency will not be the gravitating pull for those experiencing a loss of culture, identity and community. Why question theology if you are lonely and frustrated by the empty vacuum of postmodern mindless materialism and the shallowness that we call western values today, when you can convert to Islam, Bag yourself a wife and find yourself fueled once again by a sense of purpose and identity?

        • bluedog

          Quite right. Islam is the perfect antidote to the bruised egos of young men, disillusioned by the feminisation of western society.

          • magnolia

            Perfect?

            Women can get uppity so let’s put as close as possible to a bag over their head so they cannot feel the wind on their faces and be hardly visible, so that men don’t have the inconvenience of exercising a modicum of internal self-control over their sexual desires….

            Perfect is the internal ethic, of purifying inner nature through exposure to God, not of those who cannot do that so impose draconian self-centred extinction of temptation. Jesus said as much (Matthew 5.28); that is perfect.

            Not to suggest Ariane Grande parades her rather bony chest and cleavage-light in bra and knickers, which I guess is undue provocation to (I can only think a rather sad subsection of) men. She is quite possibly programmed or drugged to do this, as it is far from normal behaviour, and rather mentally weird.

          • Manfarang

            You just don’t get it.
            Who wants to see an Arab woman’s face?

          • Brian

            There are many lovely Arab women (the men are another question). But in any case, most Muslims are not Arabs, they are South Asians, South East Asians and Africans.

          • Manfarang

            Most of those in South East Asia don’t cover there faces.

          • HedgehogFive

            You have told us that you used to reside in the Middle East. If that is the way you thought, you are lucky the locals didn’t (quite reasonably) do you over.

            However, it does suggest that one could, in jest, describe the burqa or whatever as “prevention of horrorism”.

          • Manfarang

            In some of the Gulf states there are more foreigners than locals.

          • bluedog

            Yes, perfect. Islam is a man’s religion, designed to appeal to male insecurities by subjugating women. I’m merely stating opinions drawn from observations, although not agreeing with them. As you seem to suggest.

        • Manfarang

          Wot give up drinking?

  • len

    This world became decadent with the fall of man.Decadence ‘is the signature’ of fallen man. Gods Law was’ the brake’ on the fallen nature of man, Gods Law was ‘the lid’ on Pandora’s box.
    Now the lid is off and we are seeing the unrestrained nature of fallen man , and its not pretty.
    Sodom and Gomorrah were judged not for being homosexual but for the flaunting of their sexual sins and the encouragement of others to partake in them.

    • Manfarang

      32 Come, let us make our father drink wine, and we will lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father.

      • Royinsouthwest

        The Fall that Len mentioned was rather earlier than the incident you referred to.

      • len

        ‘The Fall’ occurred in Genesis 1.

        It never ceases to surprise me how little time it took for Satan to deceive mankind, and still does.

        • Anton

          Genesis 3?

          • len

            Yes,thanks Anton.

          • Manfarang

            and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.

  • andrew

    Just supposing pop artists altogether stopped promoting sexual degeneracy, and all western nations implemented new ‘Muslim friendly’ foreign policy, even to the extent of ignoring Christian persecution in Muslim lands for fear of upsetting Muslims, and we basically submitted to every demand made by our imported Muslim cousins – does anybody think we’d honestly end up with peace, inter-community harmony and unrelenting happiness??

    • BigMach

      I think you have missed the point.

  • BigMach

    The A of C should have written this rather than focussing all the churches energies on the relative poor.

    • Inspector General

      One expects he weighed up the odds on it. Criticise and lose his street cred or keep his mouth shut and retain such cred.

  • magnolia

    I’m afraid that the hardcore violent Muslims care as deeply and aggressively, if not more so, about Christians calling Jesus the Son of God, and about our wonderful doctrine of the Trinity, as they do about the unquestioned moral degeneracy of these lyrics.

    I saw a report on RT (which runs some stories otherwise not aired) that 11,000 blank Syrian passports were recently stolen, probably by IS.

    Coming to a shore near us, I guess.

    We need to pray hard and apply lots of pressure in relevant quarters.

    • Linus

      You get your news from Russia Today?

      ROFL!

      I already knew of course, but you really do live in Cloud Cuckooski Land, don’t you?

    • Maxine Schell

      I think that is old news……unless it has happened again.

  • Cressida de Nova

    Sorry this off topic..
    Jack’s first operation has been successful. He asked me to send his regards and thanks for your good wishes and prayers. He is now preparing for his second operation .

    • IanCad

      Thanks Cressie. Please convey my best wishes for his full recovery,

    • Chefofsinners

      Don’t let him read this article. It could be fatal.

    • David

      Thanks for the update. Send him my best wishes for a full and speedy recovery.

  • David

    Even if we were Muslims this violence would still exist we would then get killed by Sunnis for being Shia or vice a versa.

    • Chefofsinners

      Yes, those who are averse to vices are particularly at risk.

      • Inspector General

        We are getting killed because our politicians wish, for some reason best known to them, to import raw humanity into the UK. Humanity without Christian values. Raw humanity is a disgust, and will always be so. And always was.

        • Chefofsinners

          I’d be more bothered about North Korea at the moment.

          • Inspector General

            Travelling by London Underground (or maybe avoiding where possible) just pips North Korea…

  • Simon Platt

    I admit, it was a kind of test. Cranmer passed.

  • Chefofsinners

    The truth is that Ariana’s lyrics and Western smut generally are not a cause of terrorism. No more than a bomb on an aeroplane means aviation is to blame, or a crossbow bolt fired into The Oval means it’s all the fault of cricket.
    The aim is terror, wherever and however it is most easily spread.
    The cause is a cocktail of every sin known to man, mixed by Satan through a false religion which lends itself to manipulating people.
    “Our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against principalities and powers in high places.” But Jeremy, poor boy, runs about all uncomprehending, chasing simplistic solutions.

    • Dominic Stockford

      Such lyrics and behaviour as hers are a ‘hostage to fortune’, giving the claims of the extreme muslims easy examples to use to demonstrate the utter depravity of the whole of Western society.

  • .Is Ariana Grande sponsored by Wonderbra?

    • DWMF

      Supported, perhaps.

  • Maxine Schell

    I think a culture that sings those lyrics will self-destruct……no Muslims needed.